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02/12/2007 07:23 PM ID: 60145 Permalink   

Russia Rebuilds Military Industrial Complex

 

The Cold War may be over but with Vadimir Putin's sharp criticism of US militaristic approach last week (SN reported) that seems far from true. Mr. Putin said Russia is partnering with India to build futuristic fighter planes.

Since Putin came to power and with the rising cost of petroleum Russia's defense budget has steadily risen it will increase by 23 percent this year to a high of 32.4 billion.

According to Mr. Putin, Russia has nothing to fear from the US because of a new Topol-M ballistic missile which can penetrate the United States missile defense shield currently being tested. The US still holds solid leads in the design of top end weapons.

 
  Source: news.yahoo.com  
    WebReporter: keanu1982 Show Calling Card      
  Recommendation:  
ASSESS this news: BLOCK this news. Reason:
   
  27 Comments
  
  I recommend you  
 
guys read the source it LOADED with information,
 
  by: keanu1982     02/12/2007 07:24 PM     
  Yea, it's loaded alright  
 
Maybe I'm biased because I'm sick and tired of the Western media holding the east to a different standard than it holds the west. In defense especially - Europe and America can build up their forces and sell weapons, but when we do it, we're "rekindling the Cold War"? The implication in that statement is that Russia's defense redevelopment and weapons sales are done in a military effort *against* the West. This is a double-standard, and in many ways, inaccurate.

For example, this article:

1) It seems to imply that Russia is beefing up some new fearsome military, the article itself admits that the bulk of the defense spending will be used to REPLACE and update outdated weaponry.

2) The article uses the phrase "[Russia] Key supplier for 'rogue regimes'". But these "rogue regimes" named are for the most part far from it.
Venezuela is a country with a democratically elected government whose biggest crime appears to be having a president who's outspoken about Bush. China is America's biggest trade partner. India is a US ally.

In fact, the only "rogue nations" listed here would be Iran and Syria. To criticise Russia for selling weapons to Syria, when the US pours tens of billions into Israel and Russia's TOTAL arms trade equals a comparatively tiny $6 billion is laughable. As for Iran, Russia has sold defense systems to Iran after Israel announced their intention to use NUCLEAR WEAPONS against Iran.

[http://www.timesonline.co.uk/...

I'm sick of these double-standards, and journalists who throw around inflammatory, sensational language. The facts speak for themselves.
 
  by: Volkova_Nova     02/12/2007 08:24 PM     
  @ Volkova_Nova  
 
If this makes you wanna puke you should read the way practically everything is written about Chavez . Here’s an example from borev.



Editing by Numbers

Step 1: Open with one paragraph on something newsworthy that Hugo Chavez says or does, the more vague or ominous the better.

Step 2: Cut straight to the criticism from opposition to show how what he’s said/done is evil, hypocritical, or just plain stupid.

Step 3: Sprinkle liberally with the standard reminders that Chavez is a cynical opportunist who is tight with Castro and totally opposed to America and your Way Of Life.

Step 4: Cycle back to the original news hook, and maybe, space available, add a pertinent detail or two.

Well the AP’s Ian James flouted these rules today He brazenly opened his story with two paragraphs on Venezuela’s new environmental initiatives, and offers space for Chavez to rebut critics with pertinent details.
Fortunately, a diligent editor was on duty, and was able to trim the article down to a more recognizable storyline. Unfortunately, the article no longer makes any sense.
Now, in step four, the article references “bulbs” that were edited out of the paragraphs above. (These were fluorescent light bulbs that the government has made available to save energy). It mentions a “solar energy research center” without the pertinent info on the government’s plan to decrease dependence on fossil fuels.
We get it! Newspapers are pressed for space. Sometimes editing jobs are sloppy. Thankfully, they managed to keep the important stuff. None of the paragraphs on Castro, Anti-Americanism or critics were cut. Because you hadn’t heard that already.

Read the 19-paragraph original story here http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/... and cross reference it with the 11-paragraph “just the facts” version.http://www.onelocalnews.com/...


I gave this a good feedback all the same because keanu1982 doesn’t usually post . I can’t stand people who just bicker and never post sort of takes the community thing out of it …
 
  by: Hugo Chavez     02/12/2007 08:45 PM     
  @Hugo  
 
I gave this a good feedback all the same because keanu1982 doesn’t usually post . I can’t stand people who just bicker and never post sort of takes the community thing out of it …

In case you didnt know. Im at work almost everyday and Im a very busy person, if I come across an interesting article I would post it in the forum preferably because theres no need to edit posts which takes a lot of time out of my work day, so give me a break!

 
  by: keanu1982     02/12/2007 09:37 PM     
  @keanu  
 
Um, Hugo was praising you for taking part. Simmer down there.
 
  by: Volkova_Nova     02/12/2007 09:43 PM     
  umm  
 
I would never trust Russia and would always hold them to a different standard. Think about how many people would be alive right now if they never polluted the world with Ak-47's and all the other crap they still send all over the place.
 
  by: steme   02/12/2007 10:15 PM     
  @stem  
 
and now would you like to say the same about the m-16? You critisise Russia for the ak-47, yet it is a robust and sturdy weapo. for example, ak-47 was buried for god knows how many years, Russian officer pulls it out of the ground & says something like "ak-47 is great etc etc, will work no matter what etc etc" holds it in the air and fires.

Off track story but ah well, point is the USA made the m-16, thats killed lots of people, they made lots of weapons that were used for killing people so saying russia is bad for making a gun that is using for killing people is just plain stupid, sorry.
 
  by: wingedpuma     02/12/2007 10:51 PM     
  @steme  
 
and another thing, the USA sends weapons everywhere, they supported guerilla's in the past to overthrow governments they didnt like.
 
  by: wingedpuma     02/12/2007 10:52 PM     
  One sided story...  
 
America plays the peacemaker while selling guns to just one side. This is the country that sold the Soviet Union the virtues of 'freedom'. This makes 'freedom' look two-faced.

And when China sells Iran anti-cruise missile systems , that's a provocation. Like all drama queens , the USA has to make every thing all about me. Israel seems to have a right to an arsenal of nukes and Iran threatens the world if it wants to install a nuclear deterrent.

Israel operates death squads and Canada applauds them. Canada talks about playing hardball with China and the guy doing the talking has a gulag full of Arabs in iron masks.

The Arabs say that they are fighting Israel and we say that we are fighting 'terror'. That would mean that we are fighting for Israel when Israel isn't even involved in the military action. Who's that stupid?

The western press doesn't have the depth of water on a bridge. And their consistent racial bias against Moslems isn't making them look like they respect human rights.

Someone needs a nice mouthful of good ol' soap. Maybe that's what the Ruskies are thinking about us. They see how soaked we are in deception and they know from first hand how dangerous that makes us.

Our enemies face us with bio-warfare as a last line of offense. The closer we come to victory in this war for Israel , the closer we come to being attacked with bio-weapons.

That's a good reason to clear the lies off the table and focus on facts. If we're gonna bite it I'd like to think we'll go with our eyes wide open.
 
  by: Rip Snorter   02/13/2007 12:19 AM     
  @wingedpuma  
 
In America I can get a Ak-47 faster and cheaper then a m-16 just like every other country in the world lol
 
  by: steme   02/13/2007 01:02 AM     
  @steme  
 
So considering that Russia's total arms trade is at $6 billion - a fraction of what the US generates in arms trade - I suppose your mistrust of America must be that much higher.

What's that you say? You want to see the numbers? No problem, "comrade":

[http://www.fas.org/...

Next!
 
  by: Volkova_Nova     02/13/2007 01:10 AM     
  Hmmm  
 
With America's actions around the world in the past seven years, I wouldn't blame any government for bolstering its military, particularly in a country that has oil reserves.
 
  by: l´anglais     02/13/2007 01:19 AM     
  Nova  
 
I dont care how much they make. There is no American made weapons causing mass genocide in Africa and other places. Sooo like I said before I will find a Ak-47 faster and cheaper then an M-16 in America and any other country.
 
  by: steme   02/13/2007 01:34 AM     
  @Volkova_Nova  
 
I have to agree with many of your comments. People in this country (The USA) fail to see much of our propaganda that is spewed by our government and media. People tend to think that the USA is cleanest, nicest, best 'do good' nation in the world.
I remember when we went after Iraq, everyone was all gung ho and now look at the war, its a waste of life.
Sure, Russia sells weapons, but so does the USA. Don't forget who armed the Taliban under Reagan!
 
  by: cbuilding   02/13/2007 01:40 AM     
  steme:"I'm not listening; la-laa-la-laa"  
 
Now if we chart this discussion, at *this point* (steme:"I dont care how much they make."); communications break down.

So gentlemen and ladies, time to put on our ear-defenders too and start our cyclic arguements again.

(sound of a broken record playing as everyone starts their 'cut-n-paste' arguements from previous discussions)
 
  by: redstain   02/13/2007 01:45 AM     
  @steme  
 
You said:

"I dont care how much they make. There is no American made weapons causing mass genocide in Africa and other places."

Why not just plug your fingers in your ears and shout, "Nananananana!" ?

The information I just handed you shows how the US arms trade contributes to armed conflict around the world (yes, that includes Africa!), and how this nation leads the world in this industry, thereby leading the world in the business of death.

The Kalishnikov? By comparison, a drop in the bucket. An absolutely weak and pitiful detail to rest your argument upon.

Next!
 
  by: Volkova_Nova     02/13/2007 01:50 AM     
  more fair and balanced than Fox ever will be  
 
I'm not saying Russia's not getting a little kick back from weapons sales, hey, I know that the British are planning to revamp it's nukes in the next 10 years. (The support of the war was just a 'quid pro quo' for a discount on the forth coming deal with us.) I'm sure the Russians are planning to upgrade. Personally, I've brought myself a new catalyst 5500. Everyone's treating themselves now and then.

It is annoying - though understandable - how people who don't know any better can be so blinkered, and yet bullish about it as well.

 
  by: redstain   02/13/2007 01:55 AM     
  we all kill each other...  
 
Its for money and opinions. Opinions include religion, politics, and economics. They are all wrong for doing it.

Plus if it wasn't for guns we'd all be killing each other with sticks. Most of it is the lack of knowledge and understanding, but even when we have those two thing we will do it for money.

Thats the main factor right there. The US defense has nothing to do with what we are doing in other parts of the world. I would also like to add that Bush is about as Christian as Judas. That goes for 90% of the christians I know too.
 
  by: kuhl   02/13/2007 06:15 AM     
  input about putin  
 
try: Vladimir

or is Vadimir also correct?


 
  by: stop4trains   02/13/2007 07:19 AM     
  @keanu1982  
 
yeah I was backing you up on posting news. Most people don't post but are the first to jump in and say you're biased etc or this is a left wing site . It's great to see others getting off their asses once in a while and posting .....
 
  by: Hugo Chavez     02/13/2007 09:06 AM     
  @Volkova_Nova  
 
If you want to get an understanding of why Americans don't trust Russia as has been voiced here just pop on over to the internet archive and take a look at some of the crap they were fed during the 50’s 60’s 70’s 80’s and the best part of the 90’s it’s a real eye opener . I mean my mistrust of the media began when the Berlin wall went down and suddenly for the first time ever we got to see images on TV of good looking Russian women. Prior to that the only images we got of Russia females were fat women in the freezing cold in a bread queue to buy bread oh and in black and white just to add an extra touch of evilness. I began to ask myself where were all these beautiful Russian women during the cold war (apart from the ones in Bond movies and they were to be mistrusted because they were spies) and if they sold us this packet of crap what else have they sold us . Sadly it’s like opening a can of worms once it’s open you realize our perception of everything around us has been highly controlled in the interests of the powers that be , but thats another thread perhaps.
 
  by: Hugo Chavez     02/13/2007 09:13 AM     
  I'm surprised  
 
They're building a new fighter with India.
I was under the impression Russia and China had at least cordial relations, whereas India still technicaly claims rights to some chinese territory,

Isnt India buying the Eurofighter anyway?

Does seem a little biased when taken in comparison to the military budgets of others.

Still, you cant blame the soviets for making a gun that fires everytime you pull the trigger, someone was going to eventualy.
 
  by: Gogevandire   02/13/2007 09:53 AM     
  @american bashing  
 
even though many of you have posted valid criticism of the US ... i suppose my question of you would be, so because one does it, its ok for another? i hate to say it, but many of you need to ask yourselves "if johnny jumped off a bridge ... " well, you get my point.

Selling weapons to Israel is also a bit different than selling to Iran or Syria for one reason ... Israel recognizes Iran and Syria.

I am by no means sympathetic to everything Israel does ... but i am sympathetic to their desire to exist.
 
  by: bpearson   02/14/2007 05:24 PM     
  @steme  
 
"There is no American made weapons causing mass genocide in Africa and other places."

Since when do guns cause genocide? If they didnt have AK's they would have something else. Are you really that stupid? They want to kill each other, the guns dont want to kill people, peoplew ant to kill people.
 
  by: OneEightSeven   05/06/2007 03:04 PM     
  Russia feels the need to respond..  
 
they have to, if you're aware of the neocons "PNAC" plans, "full spectrum dominance" and all.

China, Russia warn of WORLD DOMINATION:

http://www.usatoday.com/...

Read a lot more through http://www.cooperativeresearch.org

These events have been in the build up for years. Formar PNAC member Fukuyama said that they initially saw China as the greatest threat to US dominance but when 9/11 it was "godsend" to control the oil in the middle-east. If you control the oil, you can control other countries growth.

Africa's oil will be a battlefield as well. And the military industrial complex might feel a need to invade Venezuela.

This is why I often speak about the neocons who have began a new cold war again.
 
  by: Kaleid   05/06/2007 03:26 PM     
  @steme  
 
" Nova
I dont care how much they make. There is no American made weapons causing mass genocide in Africa and other places. Sooo like I said before I will find a Ak-47 faster and cheaper then an M-16 in America and any other country."

where can i get one of these guns... i gotta see this...lol.... i've never seen or heard of a weapon commiting genocide... only the assholes using it.

the ak-47 is widely used because its cheap to manufacture and is one of the most reliable guns ever made... don't be pissed off that american made weapons are inferior in durability and popularity... and the damn this has stood the test of time... what is it 60 years old now?

i trust russia more than the US as i see the US abusing its power on a daily basis... this is a problem that predates the bush admin... or even his fathers admin.

and btw since you have a problem with the ak-47... you should certianly have a problem with bombs/missiles... as their destrcutive capability is exceedingly greater and is far more indescriminate in its killings... thought i doubt you have a problem with the US selling weapons...

oh and just for the record can you tell us what country it was that funded bin laden, sold arms to iraq to use against iran, and they also supported iran prior to that.

like it or not the US is the largest arms dealer globally and as such is the global leader in the sale of firearm violence...

blaming russia for selling ak-47's, while supporting the US in their arms sale which happens to account for about 4 times more of the market of arms trade is just plain stupid.
 
  by: havoc666     05/06/2007 04:10 PM     
  @bpearson  
 
" @american bashing
even though many of you have posted valid criticism of the US ... i suppose my question of you would be, so because one does it, its ok for another? i hate to say it, but many of you need to ask yourselves "if johnny jumped off a bridge ... " well, you get my point."

well gee you have one side selling guns... what you want their enemies with fight unarmed, when more often then not the "enemy" is usually the one being invaded, usually using superior (modern, namely american built/designed) weapons.. namely talking about bombs in theis example.

"Selling weapons to Israel is also a bit different than selling to Iran or Syria for one reason ... Israel recognizes Iran and Syria."

and they would recognize israel if israel would recognize the palestinians and THEIR LAND that israel happens to be located on.

iran and syria are pretty much all the palestinian have left aside from the tract of land that they've alloted the palestinian which despite population gorwths of palestinians keeps shrinking as israel takes more land over.

"I am by no means sympathetic to everything Israel does ... but i am sympathetic to their desire to exist."

i sympathetic to the right of individuals israelis to exist, the state of israel should never have been formed as it essentially displaced the palestinians from their homeland, that would be like the US invading canada, occupying it and kicking out canadians.

thats war where i come from (canada)... israel's existance alone is the cause of a war that has never truely ended since its formation... and likely wont end until israel recognizing the rights of palestinians or until israel as a nations falls... whichever happens first.
 
  by: havoc666     05/06/2007 04:27 PM     
 
 
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