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11/06/2007 07:33 AM ID: 66252 Permalink   

Jehovah's Witness Won't Accept Blood Transfusion; Dies

 

22-year-old Jehovah's Witness Emma Gough had just given birth to twins when she began to hemorrhage, requiring a blood transfusion to save her. But since her faith wouldn't allow it, she died. Hospital staff, to no avail, begged her family.

"We are coping the best we can. There will be an inquest and issues will arise from that," said her husband. Their congregation said their faith calls them to "follow commands from the scriptures and it is a scriptural command to abstain from blood."

A neighbor said "How could she make that decision not to have a transfusion and leave those babies without a mother? It's terrible, I don't care what your beliefs are, to refuse treatment like that is awful."

 
  Source: www.dailymail.co.uk  
    WebReporter: caution2 Show Calling Card      
  Recommendation:  
ASSESS this news: BLOCK this news. Reason:
   
  25 Comments
  
  @  
 
Religion: 1 , Twin orphans: 0

HAHAHA, take that you BABIES!!!
 
  by: silentrage   11/06/2007 08:11 AM     
  Jehovah Witness blood ban is bogus  
 

Jehovah's Witnesses elders will investigate and disfellowship any Jehovah Witness who takes a blood transfusion,to say the issue is a 'personal conscience matter' is subterfuge to keep the Watchtower out of lawsuits.

Many Jehovah's Witnesses men,women and children die every year worldwide due to blood transfusion ban.Rank & file Jehovah's Witness are indoctrinated to be scared to death of blood.
FYI

1) JW's DO USE many parts aka 'fractions' aka components of blood,so if it's 'sacred' to God why the hypocritical contradiction flip-flop?
2) They USE blood collections that are donated by Red cross and others but don't donate back,more hypocrisy.
3) The Watchtower promotes and praises bloodless elective surgeries,this is a great advancement indeed.BUT it's no good to me if I am bleeding to death from a car crash and lose half my blood volume and need EMERGENCY blood transfusion.

Know this,the reason that JW refuse blood is because of their spin on the 3000 year old Biblical old testament,modern medicine will eventually make blood donations and transfusions a thing of the past.When this technology happens it won't vindicate the Jehovah's Witnesses and all the deaths that have occured so far.
The Watchtower's rules against blood transfusions will eventually be abolished (very gradually to reduce wrongful death lawsuit liability) even now most of the blood 'components' are allowed.
In 20 years there will be artificial blood and the Red Cross will go on with other noble deeds.
None of these changes will absolve the Watchtower leaders or vindicate their twisted doctrines
Are there dangers from blood?There are over 500 aspirin deaths in USA yearly.
---
Danny Haszard born 1957 3rd generation Jehovah's Witness
 
  by: DannyHaszard   11/06/2007 08:16 AM     
  A laugh at the Jehovah's Wintesses' expense  
 
One fine summer morning I was preparing for a pistol competition. I was unshaved, had no shirt on, barefoot, just wearing jeans and gun leather, four magazines and a Colt .45 Gold Cup in the holster. Practicing fast draw, switching hands, etc.
A knock came at the door. Jehovah's Witnesses. A man, his wife and a young daughter. Answering the door, was an unshaven half-naked black man with a huge pistol strapped on, and another one
lying on the coffee table.

They looked at me, they looked at the gun. They looked at me, they looked at the gun. They looked at the gun much more closely, then the man said, "We can see that you're busy right now. Perhaps we'll come back at a more convenient time."

They left a smoking rut in the sidewalk getting away from my house. Never did come back.

I wish I had a video of that incident.
Kids, try this at home!

 
  by: white albino   11/06/2007 10:19 AM     
  Another darwin award is won  
 
If your stupid enough to follow instructions that lead to your own death then you deserve what you get.
 
  by: sparky_fox   11/06/2007 10:28 AM     
  So  
 
she chooses to sacrifice her life and children for the sake of this . how stupid is that.
 
  by: captainJane     11/06/2007 01:00 PM     
  Just dumb  
 
heard a case like this before when a woman told doctors not too give her child a blood transfusion, the doctors told her she would need one or she would die ,but the woman said no, the hospital took the case too court and was granted permission to give the transfusion,poor kids, losing a mother and being stuck has jehovahs witness ,raw deal
 
  by: Jammy-Doger   11/06/2007 01:42 PM     
  Are there  
 
any Jehovah's Witnesses here that can attest to this or what?

I'm finding more and more people are acting like they are brain washed when it comes to Mormonism and Jehovah's Witness. Granted one can call the rest of the mainstream religions a dirty rotten sect all together but I'm always hearing about these two in particular when it comes to brainwashing and off the wall beliefs.
 
  by: Jediman3     11/06/2007 02:37 PM     
  While..  
 
I'm usually of the opinion that a person's religion is their own business (unless they're trying to fprce it on others), I have nothing but contempt for this person. Those babies are now without a mother because she chose to die rather than have a transfusion. In a way it's actually suicide (which is also prohibited in the bible), in the sense that her death was preventable, and she chose not to prevent it.
 
  by: StarShadow     11/06/2007 04:34 PM     
  You choose  
 
As we progress medically in technology there are many more people today who refuse blood transfusions for several reasons.

Personal, medical or in this case religious reasons.

Many people are pro choice on this forum when it comes to what someone does with their body. Well this woman excercised her right to choose.

I seriously doubt that her and her family thought she would die. Doctors say that schpeel about "you are going to die if you do not accept blood"

Can the doctor actually guarantee that you would live if you do take it? In all honesty he cannot make that guarantee either.

I've known of 4 cases where doctors said the same thing to individuals, 2 of them documented on tv. And guess what? Because of other more skilled doctors those individuals lived. Obviously it could be done without blood and they did not die despite what the doctor said.

One such example was an aquaintance of mine who was thrown out of his truck as it flipped over and the truck landed on the right side of his body. He was ran to the hospital. 3 local hospitals turned him down because of his refusal of blood saying he would die if he did not take blood. 3 hospitals, the 3rd finally took him in and handled it without blood, they used expanders and various alternatives. He did not die.

In many cases the use of blood is simply working in the doctors comfort zone and many are afraid of the liability.

There are often times many ways to do a certain thing and many various treatments for the same illness. Sometimes doctors go for the one they have most experience with or the old fashioned way. But if that was always the case we would not have as much progress in the field.

In many cases individuals who refuse blood, not all just JWs, create a demand and doctors end up needing to create a supply for that demand, thus bringing about new advancements in the technology. In a few years down the road blood transfusions may be obsolete all together or considered archaic all because someone created that need for bloodless surgery.

On another note Doctor's make that strong claim that if you do not take blood you will die but do they ever mention "if you do take blood you could die or get an infection of some kind"

http://en.wikipedia.org/...

There are also individuals who choose not to take other kinds of treatment. Some people do not accept chemotherapy for cancer. It is their choice. Everyone should be given that freedom to choose what drugs or things are put into their body.


 
  by: shawn1flog   11/06/2007 07:26 PM     
  just a side note  
 
There are many factors in this case. We were really not in the situation.

Being that the article lists about 17 deaths in child birth per year. Would you want your hospital and your name as a doctor to be the one that is linked to the death of a woman? Think of the liablity if you as the doctor messed up and could have saved the woman without blood but wasn't skilled enough?

Often times it is human nature to pass the buck and the heat.

Not saying that is the case but saying there is many possibilities.

In another 100 Doctor's hands maybe this patient could have been saved but this doctor was just not the one who could do it.

First thing I'd do is say "it wasn't my fault, it was the woman's fault because <insert excuse>" Think of the pressure the doctor had.

Point is we do not know the whole story.

For example did the doctor already know in advance that she was a Jehovah's Witness and they do not accept blood. Did he take extra precautions if that case was to arise? Why did he not do a Cesearan which may have slightly been more controlled? Would another doctor have done better?

There are so many differant factors involved in this story.
 
  by: shawn1flog   11/06/2007 07:53 PM     
  Ok  
 
Take blood or not, we will all die. For this person to make this, the solution of her ailment is her own palaba.

Honestly speaking, I may think of this stupid and what not, but reality is that, there a parents amongst us here on SN, who smoke infron of their children! At home, in the car while a baby is strapped in the chair, talk on the cell while driving etc.

I think she believes, she went with her dignity and most pious. Whatever you and I think is completely irrelevant.
 
  by: isuzu     11/06/2007 09:26 PM     
  Her choice  
 
I really can't even believe this made news, since this is pretty common practice for these folks and she's certainly not the first or the last.

What's new about dying for one's religion?
 
  by: MomentOfClarity     11/06/2007 10:01 PM     
  Genetic Culling?  
 
You'd think a backwardass cult like this would do whatever it takes to keep their members healthy enough to reproduce more illiterate,inbred,assclowns. Go figure! But I guess, like Islam...they can find a new uterus to make new Mohammads....
 
  by: Kissin'Kate   11/06/2007 10:08 PM     
  @moment and kissin  
 
"I really can't even believe this made news, since this is pretty common practice for these folks and she's certainly not the first or the last.

What's new about dying for one's religion?"

I have to agree with you on this one. I was wondering how this made the news.

People die for all kinds of things money, power, oil, greed, territory, prejudice ideas, social change, freedom and all kinds of other ideas. I don't see being faithful to a religious belief would be any differant or uncommon.

Maybe it was added here because it is so uncommon for JWs to die from not taking blood transfusions.

@kissin
illiterate,inbred???

For one I think JWs are pretty educated. They know alot about blood and blood alternatives. How many blood and blood alternatives do you know of? If you probably talked to any JW on the street I'm sure they'd have about 10 or so to tell you about.
They have to talk to educated people all the time on the streets and at their doors. They usually are good at discussing any subject, are good public speakers and read alot!

Inbred? Actually they have one of the highest levels of ethnic diversity of any other group and prejudice between groups is next to nill in fact highly looked down upon for any discrimination. Leaving them able to marry anyone from any culture and no one have a problem with it. So it keeps the gene pool active.

Among themselves they pretty much have accomplished world peace.

For example Isreali JW's and Palastenian JW's there is virtually no fighting in any way while the rest are ready to blow each other up.

While everyone followed the Germans and supported Hitler they stood against him and did not resolve to give in their moral convictions and were among the first to go to the concentration camps

http://fcit.coedu.usf.edu/...

http://resources.ushmm.org/...

And I don't think they are looking for new Mohammads. Jesus already came.

In ancient Jerusalem eating of blood in any form is forbidden.

Lev 17:10- 14
Gen 9:4
1 Sam 14:32, 33
Lev 19:26
Deut 12:16,23, 24

A common theme in these scriptures was the use of no blood. Most of it was the law to the Jews. The Mosaic law but even before the Mosaic law was in effect it said not to drink blood in Gen 9:4.

But then later after the Mosaic law was done away with for Christian folks that one law was still in effect.

Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and [from] fornication, and [from] things strangled, and [from] blood.

So most Christians know that idols are bad, fornication is bad yet in the same sentence as those things it says abstain from eating blood!

So for pre Mosaic law, Mosaic Law and New Testement Christianity what was the idea of blood all the way through? What does the Bible say? But that is if you believe in the Bible.

JWs believe that blood is a sacred symbol. Similiar to how patriotic people feel about the flag as being a sacred symbol of their country.

Think of someone who is dedicated like an honorable soldier to the US government. We have many fighting for what they feel is their duty and they love their country and would do anything for it.

Would it be strange if a soldier was captured by an opposing force and was told to desecrate the US flag or die and he refused to do so because he respects that as his countries symbol? If he desecrated the flag to save his life people would probably understand as well. It really is his choice in the end.

In like manner JWs view blood as a sacred symbol because in the bible it is referred to as such and there was prohibitions on eating blood.

Hence they choose not to take it.

Some may argue they are not eating blood but is it really any differant taking it through the veins?

If I smoke crack, shoot crack, snort crack or swallow crack I'm still doing crack.

JWs are able to choose other alternatives and blood fractions, such as proteins and derived from blood. Again that is their choice and up to their conscious descision.

Alot of that has to do with balance.
It would be foolish to try to go through every medical alternative and put a yes and no, acceptable and unacceptable. They just don't dictate like that. There are things in the Bible that are laws for Christians but other things are principals and personal descisions.

To illustrate: The law says selling marijuana is against the law and I could go to jail for that. However if I sell hemp clothing that is against the law.

The rule in the Bible simply says no blood as in whole blood. It did not break it down to proteins, sugars and various other things. For that matter oxygen is in blood. So JWs do not dictate each and every part of what is okay and not okay.

I mean they could get pretty into it and say not to eat steak, pork or other food because if you lo
 
  by: shawn1flog   11/07/2007 12:11 AM     
  cont  
 
I mean they could get pretty into it and say not to eat steak, pork or other food because if you look in a microscope there is still blood fragments even after you cooked it but they don't do that.

They have the view of blood that is recorded in the Bible and treat it as such. From the Old testament and repeated in the new testament. In fact JWs don't follow the old Testament but according to Acts this one rule did carry over along with things like idols and fornication. They are in the same sentence.

The woman believes in the Bible. She believed in living by Bible principals. Like the billion + people who say they follow the teachings of Christ and serve God.

My question on this story is did the doctor in fact try blood alternatives to saving her life? The article does not mention if he did or not. Some doctors suprisingly are very ignorant to the alternatives, especially the older generation doctors who sometimes are stuck in the old school way of doing things.

Here is an article on Blood Alternatives

http://www.cancer.org/...

And remember if in the next 10 years the blood supply is low, or they don't have your type blood, or the blood supply is infected by a rampant disease like SARS or Bird Flu, and you need an alternative to save your life thank the next JW who comes to your door for creating the demand, being the guinnea pig and don't forget the progressive doctors who were willing to take a shot at research and create the supply.
 
  by: shawn1flog   11/07/2007 12:12 AM     
  fake religions  
 
Always end up killing you.
 
  by: inchdeep     11/07/2007 12:32 AM     
  @inch  
 
As opposed to what? Real religions NOT killing you, and what to you is a fake/real religion? To me they are all "fake".

Remember: "My invisible all-powerful god can beat up your invisible all-powerful god."
 
  by: Rislone   11/07/2007 12:59 AM     
  @inchdeep  
 
Very interesting thought. One of the things I do have a question about noticing the Conservative Christian you mentioned yourself to be.

What is your take on the scriptures?
Pre Mosaic law
Gen 9:4

Mosaic Law
Lev 17:10- 14
1 Sam 14:32, 33
Lev 19:26
Deut 12:16,23, 24

Law to Christians
Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and [from] fornication, and [from] things strangled, and [from] blood.

So if you use the whole bible from start to finish and factor in that Christians are not under the Mosaic law yet this one law was reiterated in the same sentence. So how do you explain that law?

You can go to any Christian and they'll tell you idols are bad, fornication is bad and yet in the same sentence it says not to do these things it mentions the same decree on blood.

The general theme from Genesis to Acts is "Do not take in or eat blood because it is sacred to God"

So why would this lady have done anything wrong according to your own Bible? In fact didn't this woman did exactly what yours and every other Christians bible said to do and that is abstain from idols, fornication and blood.

The thing is that I am interested in what your thoughts on this are as a conservative Christian and please feel free to use the Bible to explain your beliefs.

The thing is I'm interested in studying all religions and have done so in many aspects,from muslim to budha even atheism.

In fact half of atheist were at one time Christians and couldn't deal with the religious rights hypocrisy and the answers they got from their church was usually less than stellar. Who could really blame them?

Personally I cannot believe some of the answers I've heard.

In response to a child's death.

"God needed another angel in heaven"
"God works in mysterious ways"
"This is to test your faith that is why they died"

or the fact that man lives 90 years tops and then has to burn forever and infinity. 90 years of badness is not equal to forever and a day no matter how you look at it. That negates God's balanced view of eye for eye. Equal exchange.
Who want's to believe in that God.

So I'm interested in what you have to say about the whole blood issue in comparison to what your Bible says.
 
  by: shawn1flog   11/07/2007 01:01 AM     
  imposing their will on others  
   
  by: mcink2   11/07/2007 02:41 AM     
  BEEN THERE as JW  
 
I was born a 3rd generation Jehovah's Witness in 1957 and endured the Watchtower's no blood commandment with longstanding bleeding Crohn's disease.

The Watchtower leadership expects followers to die for their dogma and many have.The medical staff get blamed and are 'damned if they do damned if they don't'.

The blame belongs with the 12 senile old farts in New York USA who make up the ruling governing body of the Jehovah's Witnesses
---
Don't shoot the messenger,Danny Haszard
 
  by: DannyHaszard   11/07/2007 07:20 AM     
  @mcink2  
 
What does that article really have to do with anything

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/...

http://findarticles.com/...

http://www.portlandmercury.com/...

http://findarticles.com/...

So what really is the point of your article. Sexual deviants come in all shapes and sizes.

There are police officers, doctors, lawyers, teachers, priests, parents and a great deal of people who are considered sexual predators or have done something similiar in the article you were sharing.

Point is that had nothing to really do with this article. It just proves JWs are people like every other person out there and that a sexual deviant can come in any shape and form and is a problem with society in general and not subjected to any one group.

They can come in all shapes, sizes, races, professions and religions. Have you seen to catch a predator? It could be your next door neighbor.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/...

I agree that there have been cases of JWs doing something of this nature, but there has been atheists, catholics, muslims, budhists, agnostics. I'm almost certain that anyone who does these things has some affiliation with some group or some beliefs.

 
  by: shawn1flog   11/07/2007 05:34 PM     
  Darwin  
 
indeed.

Again not fair for her to let her own stupidity orphan two children. Let's hope they don't follow the same self-destructive religious path.

Also, how comes God didn't step in?
 
  by: Maxx20     11/07/2007 11:08 PM     
  white albino's post  
 
In case you missed it, scroll up and read white albino's post. "We can see that you're busy right now. Perhaps we'll come back at a more convenient time." LMFAO!
 
  by: John E Angel     11/09/2007 08:41 PM     
  @white  
 
the last time (more than 5 years ago) that some J-dubs came to my mom and pop's house, my father just offered them two frosty cold libations at around 10 am. ... they apparently thought my pops was some godless heathen beyond saving from drink and the devil, and havent come back.

hooray beer!
 
  by: elijah4twenty     11/09/2007 08:50 PM     
  Beer is allowed  
 
In the J-Dubya's beer is allowed. In fact all alchohol is allowed in moderation and actually no one is dubbed a godless heathen. That is why they annoyingly come back over and over and over again. They've probably been back but no one was home.
 
  by: shawn1flog   11/13/2007 06:38 PM     
 
 
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