Oregon: Thomas Beatie, a transgender man, is reportedly five months pregnant. Beatie, who was born female, had a chest reconstruction and started testosterone therapy but kept female genitals when he changed gender.
A severe case of endometriosis forced his wife Nancy to have a hysterectomy some years ago. In order to start a family Beatie stopped his hormone therapy. This is his second pregnancy after having an ectopic pregnancy.
"Receptionists have laughed at us. Friends and family have been unsupportive... I am so lucky to have such a loving, supportive wife. I will be my daughter’s father, and Nancy will be her mother. We will be a family," said Beatie.
To call him a man is not quite right, since he still has female genitals. I fully expect a whole bunch of people to jump on me now for being insensitive to transgender people, but that's not my intention.
The guy lives (or lived) life as a man and identifies himself as being male. However, he was born female and didn't undergo a full sex-change operation, so whilst he may look male with his clothes on, I would say that technically, he is still a woman. He has a female reproductive system which clearly functions correctly when he is off his testosterone, which would say that the only thing making him male (other than the way he thinks) is artificial hormones.
I imagine that he is the biological mother of the child and the father was a sperm donor, but I'm just guessing as I haven't read the source article yet.
Growing up under a loving familily is important, but so too is having mentally stable parents.
I'm not against lesbian/gay families, but when you have a woman who thinks she is a man, even when proving that she definatly is a woman, well thats not exactly giving off a strong image of sanity there.
"So who is the dad? Did (s)he just reproduce on his own?"
Well, considering the man is biologically a woman, what do you think?
Whilst he looks like a man and lives his life as a man (apart from the pregnancy issue!) he has no male reproductive abilities, ergo, no penis or testicles and therefore no ability to produce sperm. So no, the conception was obviously not a solo effort.
Wow, you guys are really insensitive towards these individuals. I must say, I am quite shocked that you all are here crucifying them along with the rest of the mob. I personally feel very sorry for this couple and the ostracization they are getting from society and THEIR OWN FAMILIES AND FRIENDS.
Do you really think its his fault he was born as a Transgender? How about we all go and crucify the gays, blacks and latinos next? It sickens me to think you guys could gang up on these people like this. I stumbled upon an article a few days ago that really made me think twice about how we treat "genders" in our society.
http://www.cauldronfarm.com/ Now mind you its a bit of a read, but by far one of the best articles I have ever read. It sure does make you think twice about societies need to label people.
Now when you all have children and they turn out different than you hoped, I sure hope someone is there to segregate them as much as you have done to these unfortunate individuals.
No one is borm transgender (the definition is to change gender so to be born transgender is an oxy moron)
And I know you mean the mind set but again, not really because 100 years ago it wasn't an option you just became a preist or nun and represed your sexual desires/being your whole life.
.....and no life is not Fair.
Personally i dont give a sh!t but she is now just an ugly woman who takes testosterone, she still have a womb, ovaries and vagina. But if it makes her happy......
Your right, life isn't fair. But that doesn't mean we should just give up trying to make it fair.
Also, 100 years ago we enslaved Africans and repressed women ... are you saying that you support that as well?
Also, what if one of your children turned out like this? Would you support them? ... or would you go and call your own offspring "an ugly woman who takes testosterone". I personally would love my children no matter what path they choose to take in life, however maybe that's just me ...
I am lost and joining BlackWidow with this further confusion.
How the hell did you arrive to add Blacks and Latinos, beats me, next thing someone is going to use iraq and Iran and G-Bush etc etc, but hey thats freedom.
However in this case, problem lies with, as long as she is happy thats ok.
Question: Ok she is happy thats fine, why did it become news!? Now you get the drift, because it is very very weird news, that made me scratch my head, while I am already thinning.. Bah.
We are not, or at least I am not laughing at her, but just thinking why the hell did she become half and half?
It is either you are female or male. <Thats, Period-- Looking like a girl to attract male while still packing, is a serious crime to a straight man, choices of how to deal with that, is a different issue (No violence pls) we are not Neanderthals,,, but Seriously,, Dang I still cant get over it... What the hell forget it, I am soo getting a headache right now...
The reason I arrived at talking about Blacks and Latinos is because they are also considered "minorities" in our society. Which is no different than him.
"next thing someone is going to use iraq and Iran and G-Bush etc etc"
LOL ... don't worry, I won't drag that one out in this thread. ;)
"It is either you are female or male."
Sometimes its not that cut and dry! Life is never black and white, we like to think it is ... but usually end up finding out there are more grey areas. This is one of those instances. For example, what sex do you call a Hermaphrodite? Male? Female? Well ... really, its up to the individual. Due to the legalities of society doctors have to classify people by gender at birth. But when people are born being sexually ambiguous, you can't make that decision. Only they can find out for themselves as they live their lives what they are. Sometimes they are raised being told "They are female" only to discover growing up that they feel more like a man than a woman.
Again, I really encourage you all to read the article I posted before attacking what I say here. It's written by a 'Woman' who was raised as one after being born sexually ambiguous, only to realize later in life she felt that she had more qualities of the male gender.
People ARE born transgendered, just as they're born gay, bisexual, straight, black, white, etc. While I can't profess to be an expert on the transgendered, being born with it is something that is acknowledged by many learned individuals (including the APA, I believe). Go research it yourself. And stop laughing at this guy.
It would be really interesting to watch a guy go though pregnancy.
On a side note what's the big deal. So he decided he wanted to live as a man but not go through surgery. Not hurting anyone.
I really don't see where this overemotional "Think of the children" argument is coming from. For the most part both people sound relatively normal and sane.
are u comparing Blacks and Latinos to transgenders and gays? its not about being a minority or not Blacks and Latinos are considered normal people like anyone else just a difference of color and origins. but gays and transgenders are not considered "normal" i personally find them freaks of nature or simply sick with a virus... This kid is screwed really...who wants to have a dad that has a vagina?? it a bit better that the kid is a girl not a boy, if it was a boy there would be no one in the house to teach him how to be a man. another bad thing while growing with a family like this, the kids will think that its ok to change genders and some might try it too.. I mean lets be honest here what did Beatie accomplish by doing this, she isnt a man, she isnt a woman she either looks like a really bad looking chick with absolutely no breasts and a beard. or a gay looking man who has a vagina instead of a penis, dont people who support them find this to be weird..!!! i dont recommend sex change operations but if u are going to do em, then do the full operation..
Obviously this is NOT a man for having a child...it is ignorant to call this person a man who has female organs...it would be ignorant to call a man a woman who had man boobs...just because she started hormone therapy and removed her boobs does not mean CRAP! oh, so when a woman has to remove her breasts due to cancer she is now a man? STUPID STUPID STUPID!
Always give me a headache, so I feel BlackWidow's pain. It's a question of precedence.
We are not the individual in question, therefore how s/he identifies to him/herself has nothing really to do with how we identify him/her.
Precedence.
Does the mind take precedence over the body when determining gender? If a person's genetic makeup is 99.9% woman, with a small variation that introduces a male psyche, does that 0.1% take precedence in identity over the other 99.9% - is this man a woman, or is this woman a man? I mean, as long as we are categorizing things, we need to have definitions, right?
Today a woman had a baby through natural means. The woman, who was born a woman, conceived naturally with a man who was born a man and even gave birth without any surgical intervention. Doctors are dumbfounded how this could happen and authorities are investigating.
It might help me understand your perspective better if you could explain the purpose of making these gender distinctions. I really don't see why it is so offensive for some people when they hear that someone does not like the gender role they are assigned.
Why is it so important for a society to set codes of conduct and clothing choices based on anatomical features?
For me gender identity is a weird issue because there never seems to be a basis for it. They say women are supposed to be less driven than men but there are plenty examples of women who work hard and are extremely professional and men who are idiotic and incompetent at their jobs. Men are supposed to be lousy at homemaking skills but look at all the male chefs. So whats the point of categorizing gender.
"but gays and transgenders are not considered "normal" i personally find them freaks of nature or simply sick with a virus..."
It's possibly fair to say that transgendered people are born with a genetic psychological disorder, but would you call a person with schizophrenia or any other well-known mental illness a freak? Not all transgendered people are even physically one gender or the other. Some people are born as hermaphrodites, they can have BOTH sets of genitals at birth, although neither will function correctly. As they age, they may look physically more male or female, but they will have already been assigned a gender at birth, before they had a chance to choose for themselves. These people aren't male or female, they are a hybrid of both. They are not "sick with a virus" they were just born different to most of us.
"This kid is screwed really...who wants to have a dad that has a vagina?? it a bit better that the kid is a girl not a boy, if it was a boy there would be no one in the house to teach him how to be a man."
And what do you mean by "teach him how to be a man"? Plenty of kids are brought up only by their mother and have no father figure at all. Most of them turn out just fine, you don't need to be taught how to be a man or a woman, all a child needs is love and stability in their lives, with parents who care for them and support them. Just because this kid's father is technically female, doesn't mean she (or he, if they were to have a son later on) wouldn't have any male role models. So you might not be able to class the father (biological mother?) as a male role model, but the kid will probably still have male relatives such as uncles, a grandfather or two and possibly male cousins too.
"another bad thing while growing with a family like this, the kids will think that its ok to change genders and some might try it too.."
I highly doubt that the kid would just decide to "change genders" on a whim! You have completely failed to understand the position of transgendered people here. They don't just wake up one day and think "hey, wouldn't it be cool to be a man instead of a woman", they genuinely feel like they are trapped in the wrong body and don't feel comfortable as the gender that they fit into physically. This kid will be more open-minded than most, but she will also understand how her father feels about his/her gender and why they felt the need to change. I would expect that the parents would also remind the kid that this isn't something most people do, most people are lucky enough to feel comfortable in their own gender.
"I mean lets be honest here what did Beatie accomplish by doing this, she isnt a man, she isnt a woman she either looks like a really bad looking chick with absolutely no breasts and a beard. or a gay looking man who has a vagina instead of a penis, dont people who support them find this to be weird..!!!"
Maybe he/she accomplished happiness. That was the whole point, to be comfortable in his/her self and to not feel trapped within the confines of a gender that just didn't seem to fit.
"i dont recommend sex change operations but if u are going to do em, then do the full operation.."
Why? Surgery is expensive and potentially dangerous and wouldn't provide fully functional genitals anyway. He would never be able to father a child, and as has already been said, the instinct to reproduce is still there, so why deny this person the opportunity to have their own offspring just because they don't fit into your ideal of what a normal person is?
If he can be happy without having the full surgery, then that's great, it's certainly a lot cheaper and safer than having surgery.
Man to wanna become a Woman has nothing to do with morphology, you may have some opposite sex traits, that doesnt make you an opposite gender.
If you have a functional organ, be it penis or vagina, thats what your sex is, to attribute sexual pleasure to your physiology and say I like to be man handled because I think I am female trapped in a mans body is just simply an excuse.
hermaphrodite are a different case to Transgender, they are a Normal beings with both Sexes and some actually use both sexes for pleasure.
There is more to gender than just genitals. Unfortunately it's very difficult for most of us to comprehend the difference, since we were born with our physical and psychological genders perfectly aligned, but not everyone is this way.
As a child, you will have identified with people of the same gender, without having to check their genitals to check whether they were male or female. You knew what gender you were, there was no question about it.
Transgender people don't just decide that when they grow up they want to be male or they want to be female. They struggle from an early age, with the feeling that they don't belong and that they don't identify with people of their so-called gender. There is a big difference between thinking you are a boy in a girl's body and just being a boy who wants relationships with other boys. Most gay people do not feel that they are in the wrong body, being transgendered does not necessarily determine a person's sexual orientation.
why transgendered people are so upsetting? I haven't heard any argument other than "they're not like the masses" yet. I still cant see a logical reason why anyone would feel threatened or upset by this guys actions.
You are right. We have no right to judge. It would seem that some who have posted here remind me of those, who when confronted with something or someone they cannot comprehend, will just kill it. I thought it was interesting to note that this woman as a teeager was a contestant in a beauty pageant and also earn a martial arts black belt. These are the things that make the world interesting.
