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08/19/2008 10:04 PM ID: 72832 Permalink   

Priest Blames Women For Sexual Aggression Against Themselves

 

According to a Roman Catholic priest in Mexico City, "When we show our body without prudence, without modesty, we are prostituting ourselves." Women's rights groups are furious over the priest's comments, whose name is Roman.

Steve McGregor, a police superintendent in Jamaica, said rapes this summer were brought on by "girls wearing short shorts and tiny bathing suits." He was criticized by a group in Jamaica that observes the way women are represented in the media.

Guadalupe Loaeza, a Mexican social commentator, says: "It gives rapists permission to say, 'Well, she had on a miniskirt.'" The archdiocese says people are taking Roman's words out of context. It was meant for "moral guidance for the Catholic community."

 
  Source: www.miamiherald.com  
    WebReporter: gws1968 Show Calling Card      
  Recommendation:  
ASSESS this news: BLOCK this news. Reason:
   
  44 Comments
  
  What they need is..  
 
public humiliation, to show the world how ridicules they are.
 
  by: captainJane     08/19/2008 10:28 PM     
  He' worked up.  
 
The priest just doesn't want to get worked up looking at the young ladies in their skirts and have to go take it out on some unsuspecting little boy.
 
  by: gws1968     08/19/2008 11:59 PM     
  @jane  
 
They're already doing that.
 
  by: silentrage   08/20/2008 12:28 AM     
  ,.,.  
 
Again i'm back to the same old song of "hey lets actually try fixing something this time" rather then just doing the same useless shit over and over.
 
  by: splicer   08/20/2008 12:50 AM     
  Ehhhhhmmmm  
 
He's not all that wrong.
There is no o single reason why a women get raped how ever the priest statement can't really be shot down because it makes someone angry. I think there is some truth to his statement.
It's not a excuse but a very interesting point that should be look into if mass exposure by media+public+internal desires= a slice of the action.

Loaeza is trying to portray that priest as a enabler, I think he offered his belief(no pun intended).
 
  by: Mannyishere     08/20/2008 01:51 AM     
  IF  
 
A group of individuals who are inclined to steal, walk to work in a nice neighborhoods, and they notices through out time some of the people leave their homes unlocked and a few times they see's inside and likes what they see , I can see the temptation breaking one of them if not 3.
 
  by: Mannyishere     08/20/2008 01:56 AM     
  I wonder  
 
what about all those little boys that Catholic priests like to rape? Are they dressed provocatively and asking for it too? I find it ironic that the Catholic clergy still likes to lecture on morality after that particular scandal.
 
  by: gryphon50a   08/20/2008 02:19 AM     
  And also  
 
mannyishere, you are an idiot. Sounds like you are a rapist sympathizer or perhaps a rapist-in-training. You already have your excuse all worked out, I see.
 
  by: gryphon50a   08/20/2008 02:20 AM     
  @ silentrage  
 
yes they are doing it for their selves, bu t there is some that will be brain washed by these fools, they really need putting in their place.
 
  by: captainJane     08/20/2008 02:30 AM     
  @gryphon50a  
 
I didn't disrespect you, so I'd appreciate it if you didn't disrespect me.
If you are going to say you were being sarcastic all I have to explain to you is that I purposed investigation to the priest claims, if criminal behavior scares you, then don't talk about it.
I really hope you read what I wrote.
Even if I were to be successful with substantiating my hypocritical perspective it would not be for a one size fits all only a crumb to understanding human behavior.

In case you are going to say you were being humorous, disregard me comment,k thanks gryph :)
 
  by: Mannyishere     08/20/2008 02:54 AM     
  @ my comments  
 
theoretical* LOL
 
  by: Mannyishere     08/20/2008 03:39 AM     
  I agree  
 
that modest is hottest, but men have to practice self control. Just because a woman is scantily dressed does not mean she deserves to be raped. That's insane.
 
  by: JonSmith     08/20/2008 04:01 AM     
  @mannyishere  
 
I am trying to read what you write but now you are not even making sense. "I purposed investigation to the priest claims"? "Even if I were to be successful with substantiating my hypocritical perspective it would not be for a one size fits all only a crumb to understanding human behavior"? WTF are you saying anyway? Maybe English is a second language for you. I believe I still disagree with you, but communication is impossible, so I give up.
 
  by: gryphon50a   08/20/2008 05:57 AM     
  From the source...  
 
The article mentioned protesters carrying signs, saying, "Clothed or naked, I am the same." Just like rapists will rape not caring how the woman is dressed. Modesty shows consideration, and keeps culture from incriminating the weak. Just a theory...
 
  by: escalus84   08/20/2008 06:35 AM     
  Yes means yes  
 
and no means no, however we dress, wherever we go.

Rape isn't about sexuality, anyway. It's about power and control and violation. A woman wearing a mini-skirt, therefore, is not raped because of her clothing, but because the man who raped her is a power-hungry, controlling, violating scumbag.
 
  by: Lois_Lane     08/20/2008 11:20 AM     
  It's partially true in my opinion  
 
I think the priest is partially true with what he says, but also it takes 2 hands to clap.

How a woman dresses or behaves in public will be a trigger for those men who are sick or weak or whatever.

just like a thief will more likely steal from an easy open house than a closed one. The open house is to blame, and also the thief!
 
  by: trynix   08/20/2008 11:27 AM     
  @Mannyishere  
 
I honestly didn't see that you used the house example before me!

Now I will say that my above post is a reference to yours :D
 
  by: trynix   08/20/2008 11:29 AM     
  Why does  
 
a woman who has confidence in her sexuality become the equivalent of an unlocked house?

That's just a chauvinistic way of sexual oppression.

A buff man walking around topless in little shorts, tanned and muscles rippling, isn't an easier target for a female rapist, why is it true the other way round?
 
  by: Lois_Lane     08/20/2008 11:35 AM     
  Exactly!  
 
Rape is NOT about sex, it's about power. The manner of dress is just an excuse, and it's really pathetic how many people have bought into it.
 
  by: StarShadow     08/20/2008 02:04 PM     
  @  
 
Calm down guys.
This time I actually think that this is just a senior moment and a poor judgement on the use of words.
I think he actually tried to point out that women these days (Especially the 14 year olds) wear prostitutes uniforms and it's not helping the sexually (or control) deprived fiends AKA catholic priests.

I'd even agree with him to some extend, I know dressing skimpy doesn't warrant rape, but some women need to act responsibly when it comes to flaunting their shit everywhere they go and flirting like crazy.
Some are just attention whores, that applies to both sex, some are too stupid to know that copying Lindsay Whorehan is not the smartest thing to do in life, and some just use it to gain unfare advantages like promotions at work or gifts/free lunches from their male friends/boss/coworkers.

I think it's just a minority of women, or at least I hope, but it does seem to be getting worse in recent years.

Thoughts?
 
  by: silentrage   08/20/2008 02:31 PM     
  @  
 
Well,

Rape is about displaying "power" as much as theft is about "getting rich".

The open door and manner of dress are excuses (or motives?), so don't give them that excuse.

simple..

And I don't think a woman who is confident about her sexuality will need to brag about it with wearing slutty clothes?
 
  by: trynix   08/20/2008 02:38 PM     
  You have both  
 
completely missed my point. The onus is not on the victim. The onus is on the rapist. Blaming it on how a woman dresses or behaves removes responsibility to the pig who goes about violating women, which is not only ridiculously chauvinistic, but also amoral and unfair.

I can't believe people in this day and age actually accept this kind of mentality.
 
  by: Lois_Lane     08/20/2008 02:46 PM     
  Erm....  
 
Well....I read it as 'Some chap with mental deficiencies that have caused him to worship an institution designed to control people by the use of insidious storytelling and outright lies - in Mexico - has said that he gets horny when he sees women in skimpy outfits'.

I mean, don't get me wrong - I do actually believe that no woman should ever be forced into sexual behaviour, but I also believe that many women tease way beyond that which should be acceptable without a reverse charge of some sort being enacted.

Wearing an outfit, however skimpy, is never grounds for rape.
 
  by: chiffington   08/20/2008 02:55 PM     
  @lois  
 
I know what you're saying, I'm just pointing out that the Priest probably didn't make a speech to justify rape and it was taken out of context.
Of course his choice of words are terribad at best.
 
  by: silentrage   08/20/2008 03:32 PM     
  @Lois  
 
I beg your pardon Madame. The power rhetoric on human psych only works in the court of law, because some shrink has coined it that way, but all it is; is human mind, there is no psychological babble that confirms what you said. However discretion is in the question, after all, just because it is appealing it doesnt mean one has to abuse it. Testosterone, very powerful hormone.

I think his (priest) words were taken out of context, but being a parent with a daughter I somehow agree with this priest.

I doubt if he saying "Rape women and then blame them for dressing scantily" he is empowering women to think modestly. Despite YES is YES and No the same, lets put a cart before the horse and not the other way around.

Even than it doesnt get pulled unless you dangle a carrot on a stick, then dont blame the stud to go for it.

Young girls the way they dress now a days leaves many man wondering whether to ogle to or to shy away before they are called perverts.

I go the gym and between Monday and Wednesday, it is the meat market. Yes I said meat market, girls are competing for the sluttiest look in the gym, spaghetti strapped tops with lace and short bottoms with the waist part rolled further down and G string pulled up to show the camel toe... Bah!!!

This doesnt mean, OK lets go rape them, but for freaking sake dont awake the dead while all you want to be is ostentatious.

But dont worry Lois. In a few years we will be accustomed to all of these naked women parading, dressed scantily in the public or gyms and then Onus will only be on the attractor and not the attracted.

As for "A buff man walking around topless in little shorts, tanned and muscles rippling, isn't an easier target for a female rapist, why is it true the other way round?" lack of these guys Testosterone! Otherwise we'd be just as victims as the culprits we are.
 
  by: isuzu     08/20/2008 04:06 PM     
  This topic  
 
tends to be as much a hot button as partisan politics and religion. But in the same light as both of those arguments is the spectrum. Many people here are proud liberals but hate to see the wackos who seem to simply want to dismantle ALL of America. Many proud conservatives detest the idea of those who want to 'execute the infidels'. There's a broad spectrum of women out there. And like the article says:
It was meant for "moral guidance for the Catholic community."
This is not to JUSTIFY rape (which is unjustifiable), but to give possible insight to its motivations.
Women dress ostentatiously and do the 'flirty teasing' thing for attention. Why? cause it works. They say that you can't legislate morality, but it sure looks that way when you lock up people for doing it wrong.
Modesty today is way different than even 20 years ago.
 
  by: crosimoto     08/20/2008 05:21 PM     
  I probably  
 
didn't make much sense...i just needed to rant. I've seen some things in my years that make me seriously wonder about why some women dress like a piece of raw meat when they're actually planning to go play around the wolves.
 
  by: crosimoto     08/20/2008 05:24 PM     
  @gryphon50a  
 
You disagree but you don't say why you disagree.
I think you just wanted the point's.You really haven't offered an explanation why you think they priest's claims shouldn't be investigated, so I guess your just giving your opinion.

Fair but I don't see why you want to insult my intelligence/ethnicity maybe your are jealous.
Don't take you attitude out with me, I didn't know that you are so freakishly anal about my typing ability.

 
  by: Mannyishere     08/20/2008 05:57 PM     
  If you break this down to the instinctual level  
 
This is a normal thing for women to do. Even other female animals will flaunt their sexuality to attract alpha males or at least males they deem more superior than others. Maybe it is on a more animalistic level and we dont want to think of ourselves this way but in the end, we are still just more complicated animals is all.

Simultaneously, women dont know what it is like to be a man. There is a lot of pressure to have sex with beautiful women. Also with our materialistic culture this is a logical leap that women dress.... well slutty. Plus with designer/clothing companies controlled by mostly men, this is another reason for this behavior.

There are many reasons for this but I dont believe its the womans fault. She knows the risks and takes them. What does separate us from animals though is the idea of rule of law. This is supposed to protect the women but in many cases simply does not work. Anyhow these are just my observations on the subject. Personally I like girls in short dresses and tight vestesses!

I guess James Brown said it best:

"It's a man's, man's, man's world!"
 
  by: slavefortheman     08/20/2008 09:42 PM     
  @slave  
 
A little bit of double standards going on?
Women acts instinctively, by being provocative.
But if Men acts instinctively, by pouncing on them, they might go to jail.

Of course it depends on the manner of said pouncing and whether the woman changes her mind afterwards. :p

i kid i kid.
 
  by: silentrage   08/20/2008 10:37 PM     
  @silentrage  
 
Heh yeah you can say it is a huge double standard but hey thats the way it seems to work.

Some women want to flaunt it and men control the world and so like to see the women flaunt it. There are exceptions of course.

Anyhow it really is a confusing topic. So many ends to consider. Im personally not a big fan of materialism but I do like the ladies dressing revealingly. But I would never do anything as stupid as to mess with them unless i knew they wanted to as well.

Again there are exceptions to this rule as well since some men do in fact go out and rape women.

Heres the best explanation: Its a crazy world and you have to look out for number 1 so be careful but also have fun at the same time! If you want to flaunt it, then do so unless you feel in danger then stay safe.
 
  by: slavefortheman     08/20/2008 11:18 PM     
  @Silent  
 
You kid NOT.. Liar, liar... LOL I am just kidding...

@Slave:

Thats exactly what it is. Instinct, however Man is one very complexed animal, who is governed by his faculties which is expected without any reservations. You have a head use it and use it wisely or face the repercussions from those who use theirs.

In Animal kingdom, those female who flaunt their sexuality for a cause, are also ready to face the fact that, the same male will, or may kill her offspring from the previous male.

Man dont do that. And those who react that way deserve to be killed or at least not take residence amongst other human beings..

But yes as human beings we do have the tendencies to shut of our faculties that helps us think logically and we become worst than four legged undomesticated beasts and SEX is number one psychosomatic in human.

But as I mentioned above, we will be better than our predecessor.

Currently and especially amongst the younger woman, modesty is nothing to be associated with, many flaunt for the purpose of race amongst themselves and popularity, they go well beyond and some to be popular, all that matters is one selves perception, what they dont understand is that; consequences are dire many a times.

NOT ALL, but many women dress to impress opposite sex, especially singles (Giving benefits of argument) unfortunately they attract more than what they can chew. When a flower is blooming in the forest, many flying creatures will land on it, not only Bees or butterflies, sometimes Shit flies will also have their share of nuisance. I read this comment somewhere.

"These Little school girls now a days dress up Like whores and Whores dress up like school girls. I dont know whether to carry candies or money"
I just laughed.

No Pun Intended.
 
  by: isuzu     08/21/2008 12:03 AM     
  Not womens fault but ..........  
 
Ok lets delve into the psyche of a rapist for a minute, if you were a rapist would you go for the girl wearing track pants and a figure covering jacket or would you go for the girl with her boobs hanging out in a mini skirt. While I agree that rape is about power it is also quite possibly an opportunity for people to get with someone that they would never have a chance with, to humiliate them and bring them down. Provocative clothing is made to appeal to men, women wear it to gain attention, while women might feel entitled and empowered by wearing such clothes they may also put them selves in a situation wear they gain the attention of someone they wish not attacked attention. I don’t think that women’s dress or manner is any excuse for rape but as long as there are people out there with no self control and no regard for the law this is going to happen and one thing that women can do protect them selves is to dress a little bit more conservatively.
 
  by: ShiftyFarker   08/21/2008 05:46 AM     
  Okay  
 
I've thought overnight on this, because I'm still completely blindsided that people in this day and age still think dress has something to do with rape.

If it were true, only sexy, flaunty girls would be raped, which isn't the case.

While we're here, oppressing a woman's right to wear and behave however the hell she likes without fear of being assaulted (which you may not realise is a whole different kettle of fish to being chatted up), let's make our children behave and dress as adults, so as not to tempt paedophiles, shall we?
 
  by: Lois_Lane     08/21/2008 09:18 AM     
  @Lois  
 
Almost every sociopath has a trigger stereotype, and rapists are no different. Often this stereotype is an imago built up in their youth. Whatever its source, it represents both an idealised target for their emotional dysfunctionality, and the trigger for it.

Sometimes this stereotype is very vague such as blonde hair or green eyes. Other times it can be very specific encompassing an age bracket, style of dress, and even the behavior of the person. The nature of the stereotype is a manifestation of the underlying psychological defect generating the impulse.

Unfortunately, it is very common for rapists for these stereotypes to map toward women who are "provocatively" dressed and of an attractive physical appearance.
 
  by: lauriesman     08/21/2008 10:26 AM     
  @lois  
 
Well I'll admit that I don't know anything about the rapist's psyche, I think only a criminal psychologist would know That. :)

But you do sound pretty sure in your statement, where did you get it from?
 
  by: silentrage   08/21/2008 10:54 AM     
  My sister  
 
is a social worker who deals with rape victims on a weekly basis, and a close friend of mine is a psychologist.

The majority of sexual assault and rape actually occurs within the victim's social circle, not at the hands of a stranger.
 
  by: Lois_Lane     08/21/2008 11:03 AM     
  @Lauriesman  
 
perhaps for the first time ever, we're in agreement. I understand the victim stereotype triggers of a serial rapist.

My main gripe in this particular thread is the mentality shown here that "oh well, if she hadn't worn that, she wouldn't have been raped". Umm, no. If the rapist hadn't been a rapist, she wouldn't have been raped.

It bothers me that victims of violent assault in any form, but particularly NON CONSENSUAL sex, are forced by our society and chauvinistic mentalities to take any responsibility for their assault.

As you said, she could have had green eyes or blonde hair, too.
 
  by: Lois_Lane     08/21/2008 11:06 AM     
  @Lois  
 
Definitely. That argument is putting the cart before the horse.

No mode of dress is a guarantee against rape, and there is no responsibility for a person to dress for their own protection. In a civilized society everyone has a reasonable expectation of safety regardless of how they dress, and how they choose to live their lives. While a woman can choose to dress modestly aiming to reduce the risk of being assaulted, it is in no way any woman's fault - modestly dressed or not.

Prudence is a great word, and it is appropriate - do we exercise prudence in what we wear, under any situation? You wouldn't wear wealthy looking close and bling when passing through a rough neighbourhood. You wouldn't wear a H8 shirt in a predominantly black neighbourhood. A woman can wear what she likes, but walking home alone in a short skirt and tight blouse is much more likely to attract the attention of the wrong person simply because there are significantly more rapists that are triggered by that appearance.

To digress a bit:

As you said earlier, rape is predominantly about power and control, and more so, it is about sexual power and control. The sociopathic pathology that leads to rape frequently develops when the rapists themselves have experienced threat events interacting with confident and sexually positive woman. Such women often do wear outfits that show off their body to best affect and so the correlation is not surprising. Women who dress demurely tend to be of a different mind-set, and hence do not generate those threat events.
 
  by: lauriesman     08/21/2008 11:27 AM     
  @Lois  
 
"Umm, no. If the rapist hadn't been a rapist, she wouldn't have been raped."

Well said, very succinct!
 
  by: StarShadow     08/21/2008 02:09 PM     
  well  
 
i dunno if i should agree with him or not

everyone is dressing like whores these days

but it doesnt give them the right to rape them
 
  by: groomsy     08/21/2008 07:42 PM     
  @all  
 
When a roman catholic priest says something like this - you squabble amongst yourselves.

When a islamic immam says something like this you unite in hatred against him.

My point is not political -

MY POINT IS BE PISSED OFF AT THIS CRAZY MORAL-STRICKEN MAN AND NOT AT EACH OTHER!
 
  by: george2101436   08/22/2008 05:39 AM     
  @george  
 
Seems like a pretty civil discussion on rape to me.

Well... compare to the other discussions going on here anyway. :p
 
  by: silentrage   08/22/2008 06:39 AM     
  Case  
 
Close. And no one is saying rape is OK because of a dress.
http://www.wkyt.com/...
 
  by: isuzu     08/22/2008 10:21 PM     
 
 
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