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09/17/2008 09:56 AM ID: 73438 Permalink   

Republicans Pushing to Remove Right to Vote From Victims of Credit Crunch

 

The Democratic party have accused the Republicans of taking advantage of the credit crisis and has attempted to block in court an attempt made by Republicans in Michigan to have people who have lost their houses stricken from the voters register.

Voting rights groups have claimed that the Republicans have been pushing for laws to make it increasingly difficult for many people to vote in the forthcoming November elections despite attempts to distance themselves from such accusations.

Republican party chairman of Macomb county said last week "We will have a list of foreclosed homes and will make sure people aren't voting from those addresses" .

 
  Source: www.guardian.co.uk  
    WebReporter: Hugo Chavez Show Calling Card      
  Recommendation:  
ASSESS this news: BLOCK this news. Reason:
   
  38 Comments
  
  Ugh  
 
That article is all over the place.

Firstly, I don't know, is a driver's license the only government issued ID? In Australia we have ID that you can get if you don't drive, that can be substituted anywhere a driver's license is usually required. So, I don't see how requiring an ID suddenly disadvantages people who don't drive?

Given the massive voter fraud in the last federal election, I'd be in favor of any measure that keeps BOTH parties honest.
 
  by: SoshiMaster   09/17/2008 10:10 AM     
  The world is seeing this...  
 
So lets guess who is going to buy their way to the presidency and it morally wrong.

Why bother voting?
 
  by: captainJane     09/17/2008 10:15 AM     
  @SoshiMaster  
 
Actually, there are available state ID cards that in most places look like a driver's license. But the argument usually presented here is that requiring ID, even to establish residency in a specific voting precinct is racially discriminatory.

Frankly, it makes sense to ensure that people actually live where they claim to when they go to vote.

Missing of course are Obama campaign efforts to help register felons. Also this is a poorly written article, which leaves much undersaid. Particularly who the campaign experts (from the Democratic Party?) are.
 
  by: Major-General   09/17/2008 11:18 AM     
  @Major-General  
 
How is requiring ID racially discriminatory?
 
  by: gimboid   09/17/2008 12:57 PM     
  @gimb  
 
Thats a good question. Another one is to the people arguing for -illegal-immigrants to have the same rights as citizens (voting, social security, drivers licenses, etc). For those who are trying to get their citizenship legal I can see something temporary. But for those who aren't: Could I move to their country and get those same rights, while not being nor trying to be, a legal citizen?
 
  by: Kroww   09/17/2008 02:51 PM     
  Makes sense to me  
 
Twisted title considering what the summary is about.
 
  by: mordaane   09/17/2008 03:03 PM     
  I stand by Hugo  
 
NT

hehe
 
  by: Rv3   09/17/2008 03:08 PM     
  @Hugo  
 
Have you ever thought of becoming a spin doctor?

What the Republicans are asking for here is perfectly legal. There's a reason the checks and balances are put into place on voting. There are so many attempts to circumvent the system to tip the scale that protections like these are needed.

People need to update their licenses to their current living address if they plan on voting. Having a list of foreclosed homes that aren't occupied to check against Voter IDs is exactly what should be being done in my opinion.

Wow man, you'll just do annnnnyyyyyyything to try and bash the Republicans.
 
  by: pcXXXtreme   09/17/2008 07:31 PM     
  @pcXXXtreme  
 
Like using eletronic voting machine that grants more vote to Bush than there are actual voters?
 
  by: Rv3   09/17/2008 07:39 PM     
  @pcXXXtreme and others  
 
There is one problem here. Government as we know it can make mistakes. BIG MISTAKES. And here is where the mistakes WILL come from. When someone purchases one of these houses and then proceeds to vote, they will also most likely be blacklisted as well even though they currently own the house in question. Who is to say after the house is purchased that it will be removed from this list. Personally I dont trust government. Especially government that is controlled by political interests... This goes both ways for repubs and dems.
 
  by: slavefortheman     09/17/2008 07:41 PM     
  @major general  
 
"Missing of course are Obama campaign efforts to help register felons. Also this is a poorly written article..."

Maybe you should write a story, then, instead of complaining about the summaries of others. Since THIS source doesn't even contain that information you want to see published, let me toss you one that DOES:

[BOTH] Parties Vie To Register Ex-Felons
http://www2.tbo.com/...

Then again, maybe that's not the information you want to talk about.
 
  by: MomentOfClarity     09/17/2008 07:55 PM     
  See Also Michigan Messenger  
 
In essence the people in foreclosure are most likely to be sub prime borrowers, and these are more likely to be democrats. There is a high probability that these people have not changed there registered voting address. An easy way to disenfranchise democrats votes. Taking advantage of the disadvantaged is slime ball politics this party is known for.

Michigan Messenger article at:

http://www.michiganmessenger.com/...
 
  by: ichi     09/17/2008 07:56 PM     
  @MoC  
 
Busted ;D
 
  by: Rv3   09/17/2008 08:14 PM     
  I'll add one thing.  
 
Fellon or not, they have as much right to vote.
What's next? Can't vote cause you are black? Can't vote cause you have a vagina? Can't vote cause your note making 5M$ a year?

And you would call that "democracy"?
 
  by: Rv3   09/17/2008 08:54 PM     
  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  
 
This is unconstitutional!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
  by: Vhan     09/17/2008 10:05 PM     
  --  
 
If you can't vote, that means you cant serve 'Jury Duty'. What a bargain! Too foreclose, or not to. LOL. JK.
 
  by: slayer06   09/18/2008 01:27 AM     
  ACORN has been involved in massive vote fraud  
 
Here in WI,
there has already been over 20 cases of voter registration cards NOT being valid.
the attorney general of the state JB van Hollen is suing the state because they will not follow federal law to check voter registations that come in from outside organazations IE acorn, all it takes is the city clerk to take the name and cross check it with the DMV, and guess whos against it? THE DEMOCRATS as usual.

last year the democrats voted AGAINST photo id for voting, while we had MASSIVE vote fraud here in the state where infact during the kerry bush elections we ended up having more votes then voters! but of course the dems were against it while thousands of REAL voters like me are disenfranchised by groups like ACORN (obama used to be a "community organizer 4 them) that are powered by the left and will do nothing to vote illegally and get these fraudulent voter registrations in.

acorn has been accused of giving ppl in the inner city here packs of ciggerettes and such to register and go vote democrat, it never ends here in WI.

the thing the attorney generl is trying to pass doesnt even include getting them to throw out the bad registrations, its just to check them the real battle will be getting them thrown out because if the dems are agaisnt just checking the regisrations to see if there valid, imagine whats going to happen when we find out that thousands are bad and the repubs try to get them thrown out, the dems are going to go all out to stop that from happening.

a figure that is said to be that 1-5 voter registration cards WILL NOT check out with the dmv database.
 
  by: cray0la     09/18/2008 02:06 AM     
  LINKS  
 
heres a story about the vote fraud acorn just got done doing, by offering gas cards or gift cards to sign up,
this is just one instance,
do a yahoo search with the words ACORN vote fraud and see how many links come up with stories about acorn workers convicted in this crap.

http://newsbusters.org/...
 
  by: cray0la     09/18/2008 02:12 AM     
  and  
 
in a battle ground state like wisconsin where a couple thousand votes could make or break a election for a candidate this is a serious serious problem

http://www.jsonline.com/...
 
  by: cray0la     09/18/2008 02:19 AM     
  wow  
 
for the world's best democracy you guys sure suck at it.

Thankfully I vote in Australia. Here we can just use a pencil to put our vote on the paper and still have results within a few hours. here I can turn up at any polling booth in the country without any ID and get to vote, yet our voter fraud is amazingly low. Here we get to vote on more than two parties without wasting our votes.


 
  by: jendres     09/18/2008 02:55 AM     
  @Jendres  
 
I've always had to show ID, and the voting support team always look up my name and details before giving me a ballot.

They have huge directories of every registered voter, and can verify you even if you're voting out of state.
 
  by: SoshiMaster   09/18/2008 02:59 AM     
  @cray0la  
 
"Name that party?" Well, here's some interesting information: http://www.clcblog.org/...

"Conspiracies to stop African-Americans from exercising their constitutional right to vote aren’t new – and neither is vote caging. The Republican National Committee has been under a federal consent decree not to engage in the practice since getting caught in the 1981 gubernatorial election in New Jersey..."

"Wisconsin 2004

The Wisconsin Republican Party announced the Saturday before the 2004 election plans to challenge 37,180 voters on a caging list developed by the party.[28] The Wisconsin GOP targeted for caging only voters in Milwaukee, which is approximately 40% black and 55% minority (black and Hispanic), according to Census data.[29] Voters in all other parts of the state, which is 91% white, were not caged."

I wonder if the latter was the same year as that little voter notification scam in Milwaukee, where black voters were contacted and told polls would be open the next day to accomodate high voter turnout? When I say that I'm sure you don't know anything about that, I wonder as much as anyone else if I'm being sarcastic or not.
 
  by: MomentOfClarity     09/18/2008 04:31 AM     
  @soshi  
 
Nope. They just check your name and address and if you have voted before on that day.

http://www.aec.gov.au/...

Of course you can make it easier for them by showing them ID but there is no national ID.

oh regarding electoral fraud:
http://melbourne.indymedia.org/...

" Electoral statistics, however, show that since 1990 more than 66 million votes have been cast for the House of Representatives, yet just 71 attempts at multiple voting have been detected. This negligible rate 'about one in a million' could not possibly have affected any election outcome. When the Australian National Audit Office conducted a review of the electoral roll in 2001, it described it as being of 'high integrity'."

 
  by: jendres     09/18/2008 04:55 AM     
  @soshi  
 
btw, those "huge directories of every registered voter" is called the roll. Hence enrolling to vote. :D
 
  by: jendres     09/18/2008 05:02 AM     
  @moc  
 
little vote fraud?
little vote fraud?

lmao more like a high scale vote fraud going on time and time again TO BENEFIT THE DEMOCRATS.

i happen to have lived in the inner city aka (a milw high crime zone) for the first 21 years of my life. the inner city is mostly black and there was never any "caging" going on, there was just as much hype about kerry here as everywhere else, polls opening times were announced on the news, on billboards and everywhere else. if the blacks didnt vote then they didnt care

there was no caging going on,

the only suspicious thing going on was the vandalzing of rental vehicles used to transport bush supporters to the polls the day of the election, the cars were vandalized by congresswomen GWEN MOORES son and another person running for mayors son at the time, they were convicted of the crimes if im not mistaken.

another thing gwen moore blew this off as nothing and went on her way.

i dont know how it really is other places but the vote fraud here is benefitting the democrats and you cant say its not, group like acorn (obamas group) has done nothing more but cheat time and time again and get caught for it and its blown off like no big deal

when states try to combat vote fraud the democrats always oppose it, ALWAYS

tell me honestly why the dems in this state do not want to cross check voter registration cards with the DMV brought in from outside groups, tell me why that the dems in this state OPPOSED photo id for voting?

please "enlighten" me, because im pretty sure i know the climate of the city and state i grew up in.
 
  by: cray0la     09/18/2008 06:07 AM     
  @cray0la  
 
Newsbusters is a right-wing website. Can't you find anything objective to back up your claims? (Hint -- Rush Limbaugh doesn't count either.)
 
  by: l´anglais     09/18/2008 06:54 AM     
  No, cray0la...  
 
I don't think you "know" much of anything, you're too much of a fanatic. Here is the vote fraud incident I was thinking of: http://www.cfpa.org/...

"In Milwaukee, Wisconsin, flyers were circulated under the banner 'Milwaukee Black Voters League' which warned that, anyone who had voted earlier in the year was ineligible to vote in the presidential election, residents who had been convicted of any offense and their families were ineligible to vote, and that violation could result in ten years imprisonment and the voters’ children being taken away.3"

Still going to blame the lazy blacks? This dirty trick made national news, maybe you should pay more attention to what goes on in your city. I think I mixed up this story with the Milwaukee incident above, but all the same, "guess which party" benefitted? http://www.nytimes.com/...

"In 2004, similar fliers appeared in predominantly black neighborhoods in the Pittsburgh area, on official-looking letterheads. The fliers said that because of unusually high voter registration, Republicans were to vote on Election Day, and Democrats were to vote the next day."

I provided sourced information on the vote caging issue, so rebut that with something more credible than your equally fanatical and biased sources and stories. I'll blame Democrats for ACORN when I'll blame Republicans for attacks on abortion doctors and the white supremacist movement. Why don't Dems want ID cards? I admit I don't much care about the issue, whether people do or don't need them, but a quick bit of internet research tells me it's because people often have to pay money to get ID, or go through some inconvenience, which can be difficult for a minority of the population. Maybe if you cared to research the opinions of others instead of trying to shout them down, you'd know that.
 
  by: MomentOfClarity     09/18/2008 07:04 AM     
  @langlis moc  
 
so the journal sentinal link i posted isnt crediable?
i think it is
the newsbusters was just ONE link i pulled from a yahoo search,
please do a yahoo search labeled ACORN VOTE FRAUD and see what comes up

the journal sentinal is BIAS to the left more then anything.


and another thing i listed sources and sources
like i said do a yahoo search and see THE COUNTLESS LINKS ABOUT CONVICTED WORKERS OF ACORN INVOLVED IN VOTE FRAUD.

and MOC

im too much of a "fanatic" to knwo whats going on in my city?

i think thats a ignorant and senseless statement especially from someone like yourself

your clearly out of touch with whats going on in my city, and if this SO CALLED caging happened then why the hell was there more 4k more votes then voters???

why didnt you address anything else i stated about asking why the democrats are against anything LEGAL to protect from vote fraud???
like photo id
like cross checking voter registations with the dmv records

i guess im too much of a "fanatic" for you to address the REAL POINTS at hand huh?
 
  by: cray0la     09/18/2008 07:42 AM     
  and  
 
how can you not blame acorn?
countless links and convictions and there out in the open about being a democrat organazation but you cant place the blame on them tho right?


one more thing, the photo id thing, they were offering a free or discounted ID for people who were without a ID
but in this day of age is there really someone out there WITHOUT a ID??
\you need a ID to buy cigs, beer, cash your check, and so on
even to get state benefits so to tell me a miniority would be disenfranchised is a bunch of crap when everyone has a ID and if they dont then they could get one for free for the voting thing,


inconvience of getting a id??
basically then its a inconvience to live life because you cannot get by day to day without a ID.


you not caring about vote fraud clearly shows where you stand,
by simply not caring about something so important, if the vote fraud was benefiting republicans do you really thing EVERY republican in the state would be trying to push photo id or the refereance check?

obviously you do not care about elections if there valid or not and to be completely honest there may be a org out there doing the same thing to benefit the republicans IN YOUR STATE and it will make your vote USELESS, but you dont care right?
 
  by: cray0la     09/18/2008 07:49 AM     
  special investigation report  
 
from the milw police department on the 04 vote fraud

http://graphics.jsonline.com/...
 
  by: cray0la     09/18/2008 08:02 AM     
  i guess  
 
that might be a fanatical and biased source for you becuase you two dont agree with it?

and i find it funny that im labeled a fanatic because i stand up for the things i believe in, but when people on your side say things that are clearly fanatical and absurd they get a pat on the back because there on your side right?
 
  by: cray0la     09/18/2008 08:06 AM     
  @cray0la  
 
"ACORN has been involved in massive vote fraud" + "Here in WI,
there has already been over 20 cases of voter registration cards NOT being valid."

20 votes is massive? So the fraud of Bush second term is a genocide to democracy?

A fraud yes, massive, by all means no.
 
  by: Rv3   09/18/2008 04:25 PM     
  In cray0las world: 20 > 1,000,000 somehow...  
 
Hey cray, you ever hear of the 2000 election problems in FL? How over a million voter registrations were modified to ensure a Bush victory in FL? Did you ever here how the companies contracted by the secretary of states office were using LIKE instead of EQUALS matches in their databases to match up convicted felons to the voter rosters? Basically they managed to remove eligible voters simply because their names would be similar to convicted felons. Oh and did you also hear how this sort of con was done only in poorer areas with majority black communities? Did you also know that blacks historically vote 90% democratic? Did you also hear how Bush only won the state of FL by 537 votes and this would have pushed Gore way over the top? Did you hear how the lawyer representing Bush's campaign in the Supreme court was the son of one of the Justices and the Justice for some reason never recused himself?

Im guessing the answer to all of those questions is a big fat NO!
 
  by: slavefortheman     09/18/2008 04:42 PM     
  @slavefortheman  
 
The answer is yes, but it's ok since it's for the good of the white country ;)
 
  by: Rv3   09/18/2008 05:56 PM     
  @cray0la  
 
"im too much of a "fanatic" to knwo whats going on in my city?

i think thats a ignorant and senseless statement especially from someone like yourself"

And just what am I, cray0la? I think that's an ignorant, senseless, and empty accusation, but go ahead and try to explain. But yes, I think you're too partisan to objectively evaluate anything. Clearly you'll believe any accusation that even vaguely alludes to the Demoractic party, but as we've seen, you're quite ignorant of similar Republican wrongdoings, even in the area of an issue of which you claim to be VERY concerned.

"your clearly out of touch with whats going on in my city..."

I think that's a pretty stupid thing to say when I've evidenced things going on in your city you're not even aware of. But then, calling someone "out of touch" is just another vague and insubstantial way of saying someone is wrong when you cannot prove it.

"...and if this SO CALLED caging happened then why the hell was there more 4k more votes then voters???"

Because those are two separate issues of fraud. When you've got so much election irregularity, it gets more complicated than such simple numbers. Having more votes than voters doesn't mean that Republicans still weren't up to dirty tricks, as my sources show and you seem unable to address.

"why didnt you address anything else i stated about asking why the democrats are against anything LEGAL to protect from vote fraud???"

I did, very specifically as a matter of fact. I suppose you'd like me to have addressed your unproven allegations and generalizations about your local party and its members? Yeah, pony up some real information and maybe I'll pay it some mind.

"and how can you not blame acorn?
countless links and convictions and there out in the open about being a democrat organazation but you cant place the blame on them tho right?"

Like I said, if you actually paid attention to what other people said instead of figuring out how to bluster about it, you might actually understand why some people disagree with you. I don't blame the DEMOCRATIC party (not the Democrat party, try and learn something there) for ACORN because ACORN is not a part of the Democratic party. They may lean that way, and their members may have committed election improprieties to benefit them, but they're no responsibility of the Dems. That may be hard to grasp for someone who thinks that the world is divided into Republicans and Liberals, but do try.

"but in this day of age is there really someone out there WITHOUT a ID??"

Yes, and who are you to tell them that they don't deserve the right to vote? They're citizens, many even served their country, and you'd tell them that because they're not a part of society you respect, they cannot vote?

"...so to tell me a miniority would be disenfranchised is a bunch of crap when everyone has a ID and if they dont then they could get one for free for the voting thing..."

People COULD get it for voting, but some don't, so no, it's not crap just because you don't understand the issue. Maybe that's their business, and some people agree they shouldn't have to. I don't agree, but if they want to argue the point, it's a free country. I'll leave it to people passionate about the options.

"you not caring about vote fraud clearly shows where you stand..."

No, as usual you have no idea where I stand and no shame in just making it up in your own ignorance. I care a great deal about vote fraud, but I'm not sure I want more government regulation to fix it, either. That's a small-government idea, maybe you ought to look into one some time.

"do you really thing EVERY republican in the state would be trying to push photo id or the refereance check?"

Yes, because that does a great deal of the work of disenfranchising people for them. That'll mean fewer lower-class voters, and those aren't the Republican base in large cities - and I'm sure that's the Dems political reason for opposing the proposal.

"there may be a org out there doing the same thing to benefit the republicans IN YOUR STATE and it will make your vote USELESS, but you dont care right?"

That'd be rather pointless, since I moved from Wisconsin to California in 2004. And the Republican tactics don't work that way, anyway. No voter ID card is going to help me if my name happens to be remotely close to that of a felon. THAT'S the Republican bag of tricks, and unlike ACORN, that's the GOP itself despite the legal ruling against it.

"i guess that might be a fanatical and biased source for you becuase you two dont agree with it?"

Ah, the modern Republican's blinders to the world - factual relativism. If some opinion piece says something, it's as gospel as if an established paper publishes it. Well, the answer to your question is no, because for some of us, whether we dismiss a source doesn't hinge on whether we want to believe it or not. That's something else you might try.

"and i f
 
  by: MomentOfClarity     09/19/2008 12:16 AM     
  Continued  
 
"and i find it funny that im labeled a fanatic because i stand up for the things i believe in, but when people on your side say things that are clearly fanatical and absurd they get a pat on the back because there on your side right?"

No, you're called a fanatic because your attitude is, "My party, right or wrong." I don't think it's either of us who've spent the last month or two on this site making vacant, driveby statements about slander and conspiracies on articles critical of Republicans. And my "side" is the Libertarians, so when one of them says something fanatical, you come talk to me.
 
  by: MomentOfClarity     09/19/2008 12:20 AM     
  "Victims"  
 
Victims of their own stupidity. Just like whats happening with the bail outs right now. If we are lucky some will jump out of buildings and land on politicians coming to bail them out.

If I, as a tax payer, bail out AIG, then do I then also not have to pay my insurance- because heck I own it?
 
  by: jprobst   09/19/2008 02:43 AM     
  @Crayola  
 
"but in this day of age is there really someone out there WITHOUT a ID??"

I am. I am also a tax paying natural citizen, who has no criminal record.

Earlier last month, I lost my wallet. My wallet which contained my drivers license. I went back to the DMV to obtain a new one, when I was told I would need a state birth certificate in order to receive a copy of the same ID I've held for years (it's been renewed though). Well, I do not have a birth certificate, I was born at home, and my parents just never got me one. So, I need to get a delayed birth certificate. While I have no problem getting one (in fact it would probably be good, I've just never needed one before), the process takes a year. Which to me is absolutely F***ing ridiculous, as they only verify 2 documents. Thanks bloated bureaucracy, and incompetent DMV workers who have failed to ask me over the last several years for a birth certificate (a letter would have been nice)!

So, alas. Yes, some people do not have IDs. Luckily(?) I will only have to wait a year, whereas I've read numerous stories of older people who don't have 65 year old documents or affidavits of their birth (because all the witnesses are dead).



 
  by: smpz   09/22/2008 06:31 AM     
 
 
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