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01/14/2009 05:53 PM ID: 76234 Permalink   

Bolivia Cuts Ties With Israel

 

Bolivian president Evo Morales has announced his government is to break off ties with Israeli over the ongoing siege of Gaza which has now claimed over 1000 Palestinian lives.

Morales also announced his intentions to get Ehud Olmert and other Israeli officials charged with "genocide" in the International Criminal Court while lambasting the UN as an "Insecurity Council" for what he deemed it’s "lukewarm" response .

Morales speaking in La Paz said "Considering these grave attacks against ... humanity, Bolivia will stop having diplomatic relations with Israel."

 
  Source: english.aljazeera.net  
    WebReporter: Hugo Chavez Show Calling Card      
  Recommendation:  
ASSESS this news: BLOCK this news. Reason:
   
  21 Comments
  
  Great  
 
Good for them! The US should take their example, but of course we won't, we all know how much Bush loves Israel. I hope Bolivia keeps their word to try to charge israel with war crimes.
 
  by: the_one   01/14/2009 07:25 PM     
  Genocide?  
 
Is Israel really committing genocide? It's horrible yes, but is it really a genocide? Do they plan on eradicating the Palestinians? I just don't understand how they could be charged for genocide...
 
  by: Zixxer   01/14/2009 07:28 PM     
  They won't  
 
Hamas has always wanted war with their enemy Israel. They've been shooting rockets into Israel since Sharon gave Gaza back in 2000. They've been shooting rockets into Israel since Israel uprooted their few settlements there in 2005 and removed them by force. I think after this incursion, the Palestinian people may think twice about their support for Hamas.
 
  by: caution2     01/14/2009 08:08 PM     
  @caution2  
 
I think quite the opposite will happen the Palestinians are going to back Hamas even more after this attack just as Hezbollah gained support following the attacks in 2006.

oh BTW Israel never pulled out of settlements in 2005 it was part of an expansion plan

http://www.monabaker.com/...
 
  by: Hugo Chavez     01/14/2009 08:16 PM     
  actually  
 
Paxman put it to the Israeli Ambassador to the UK.

http://www.youtube.com/...
 
  by: Hugo Chavez     01/14/2009 08:21 PM     
  @caution2  
 
Violence begets violence. I think it will create even more support for Hamas and even more radical organizations.

Israel is trying to escape from a hole in the ground by digging deeper...
 
  by: slavefortheman     01/14/2009 08:34 PM     
  I disagree  
 
I think Hamas will lose support after this. They are an extremist group that makes no bones about using their own people as human shields/martyrs/whatever. http://europenews.dk/...


The only reason they won the election was because people were tired of the corruption in the more moderate Fatah. What would you do if your people were constantly being targeted by indiscriminate rocket attacks? Nothing? Someone please explain to me why Hamas can't be convinced to stop shelling Israel.
 
  by: caution2     01/14/2009 08:52 PM     
  well  
 
I fully understand that however only time will tell . There were rumors of people turning on Hamas in the opening days of the bombardment I saw an interview via telephone to a doctor in Gaza on CNN+ and they asked him the very same thing he said the reality was quite the opposite.
 
  by: Hugo Chavez     01/14/2009 09:04 PM     
  @cautian2  
 
" I disagree
I think Hamas will lose support after this. They are an extremist group..."

according to the west, yes... but they are a democratically elected government, they are not extremist in palestine or even much of the middle east... israel is in those parts of the world.

"that makes no bones about using their own people as human shields/martyrs/whatever. http://europenews.dk/... "

MEMRI is a VERY biased source, you discredit yourself in using it, normally your sources are far more neutral than MEMRI's extremist support of zionist-israel...

look them up on wikipedia, under criticism they explain very well why MEMRI is a discredited source.

"The only reason they won the election was because people were tired of the corruption in the more moderate Fatah."

no actually they won because they DIDN't recognize israel, fatah did, even while their country has been occupied since the late 40's and has since been occupying land that they were mandated to give back.... knowing this is no wonder people support hamas rather than fatah. fatah was littleraly recognizing a country occupying their land AND oppressing and murdering them.

"What would you do if your people were constantly being targeted by indiscriminate rocket attacks? Nothing?"

probably evaluate whether i deserved it or not, if not then retaliate, the innocent civillians didn't deserve it but israel as an occupying and tyrannical (more accurately racist, terrorist) nation-state does.


"Someone please explain to me why Hamas can't be convinced to stop shelling Israel."

gladly, i'll invade your house, i'll peroidically push you and your family into an increasingly smaller area of the house by way of superior force, as well as peroidically killing off some members of your family...

your telling me you and your family will just lay there and take it, because it seems thats what people expect the palestinians to do, because thats whats been happening to them... FOR 60 YEARS!!!

thats longer than most of us have been alive and alot more than any jew that survived the holocaust can ever hold claim to. the palestinian are being treat much the same as the jews back in the 30's and 40's in germany... the irony is that because they'r jews most people find it unthinkable that they are doing such.
 
  by: HAVOC666     01/14/2009 09:23 PM     
  Havoc  
 
"but they are a democratically elected government, they are not extremist in palestine or even much of the middle east"

Bush was democratically elected too, so what? Why is it so hard for you to believe that support for Hamas may not always be what it was when they were elected?

"MEMRI is a VERY biased source"

Fine. Ignore the link. But if you truly believe that people in Palestine aren't of the mind that sacrificing their lives for the "greater good" isn't true, you're delusional.

"no actually [Hamas] won because they DIDN't recognize israel, fatah did"
"In the eyes of many ordinary people, the PA's performance has been a story of corruption and incompetence - and Fatah has been tainted." http://news.bbc.co.uk/...


If you were shelled constantly?
"probably evaluate whether i deserved it or not, if not then retaliate"

Well, I guess Israel felt they didn't deserve it. Continuing to shell them with rockets wasn't part of the peace accord.

"your telling me you and your family will just lay there and take it"

That's what Israel believes as well.

"the palestinian are being treat much the same as the jews back in the 30's and 40's in germany"

Really? They're being rounded up and shipped off to concentration camps?
 
  by: caution2     01/14/2009 10:54 PM     
  Israel  
 
deliberately started this, they prevented the majority of humanitarian aid from reaching the Palestinians, this by it's self probably resulted in more civilian deaths then any bombing that Israel has incurred.

To think that Israelis actions will weaken Hamas is ignorant, Hamas has been responsible for the building of hospitals and schools as well as providing welfare within occupied territory, the Palestinian people are going to be more supportive of there government that takes a stand against the Israelis preventing humanitarian aid from reaching them then if Hamas was just sitting on it's hands.

I think it was quite possible that Israel prevented humanitarian aid from reaching Palestine so as to ignite tension between the two country's, they new that rockets would resume and this in turn would give them justification for invasion and expansion of there territory.
 
  by: shiftyfarker   01/14/2009 11:17 PM     
  @caution2  
 
the Israelis arn't putting them in concentration camps, they are obliterating them with white phosphorus and DIME weapons in the street!!!

Israel is in the wrong, this can be easily evidenced by the facts, they are not letting humanitarian workers in the help cilvilians, they have shoot and bombed multipule marked UN buildings and vehicles, they want let media in to see whats going on.
 
  by: veya_victaous     01/14/2009 11:40 PM     
  @cautian2  
 
"Bush was democratically elected too, so what? Why is it so hard for you to believe that support for Hamas may not always be what it was when they were elected?"

was he??... i seem to recall machine error, voter discrimination and the supreme court electing him.

hamas would be overthrown for the inside if they weren't still supported its not liek the US where theres so many legal challange you have to face in order to do so.

your dead wrong about the support of hamas, israel's latest incursion "Galvanizes" support for hamas, not weakens it:
http://voanews.com/...

"Fine. Ignore the link. But if you truly believe that people in Palestine aren't of the mind that sacrificing their lives for the "greater good" isn't true, you're delusional."

where'd i say i believe that... if they weren't fighting for the greater good (atleast of their people and what was/is their land) then you wouldn't be fighting at all... thats why groups like hamas and hezbollah were formed and thats why they still exist today.

and it not that i'm ignoring the link i saw the exact same clip when posted by other user on SN just a few hourse, and spent a good half an hour discrediting it. its on one of this recent israel-palestinian threads, can't recall which one.

"Well, I guess Israel felt they didn't deserve it. Continuing to shell them with rockets wasn't part of the peace accord."

then maybe they should look at their history and their own recent actions, they definately do deserve it, but the innocent people that tend to get caught in the middle never do.

i'm sure sure you'll at least agree with the latter part of that.

"That's what Israel believes as well."

except they are the aggressor of the scenerio and have been for 60 bloody (quite litterally bloody) years. the palestinian would be you and you family in the scenerio i hope that wasn't lost on you, i know your smarter than that.

"Really? They're being rounded up and shipped off to concentration camps?"

the gaza stripe and the west bank are the concentration camps, thats the part people can't wrap their heads around, were not talking about bunkers like hitler used, were talking about a massive plot of land that israel controls who stays and leaves (short of armed resistance) and who lives and dies, and control their quality of live which is far lower than most homeless people in the west or the wosrt of the poor elsewhere in israel, people that don't have most of the things that even all third world countries have... their own land, their own borders, basically their own lives.

i'd love to see most people response if ANYONE did the the jews what they have done to the palestinian and for as long... you know why... because it would show the true hypocracy of the world and esspecially the west when dozen's of nations swoop in to resue the jews, while no-one except "radicals" and "terrorists" will lift a finger to help the palestinians.

even hitler had the decency (hitler and decency dont even belong in the same sentence 99.9% of the time) to explicitly kill the jews rather than make them suffer their ENTIRE life, sure he made them work in camp until they were useless to him then killed them, but atleast the suffering was short lived (completely unnessary and inhereint malicious, but atleast short lived), palestinians have been living a holocaust of their own for 60 years, 6 times longer than the nazi holocaust, but unlike the nazi holocaust, no-one (except the "terrorists" and "radicals") are helping them... rather they are supporting them... and even funding them with money and weapons technology, and yet it would be concidered an atrocity to help the nazi's in the same way.

that right there is a western supersized load of hypocracy.
 
  by: HAVOC666     01/15/2009 12:07 AM     
  Good news...  
 
but what the hell does Isreal lose from losing ties with Bolivia?
 
  by: Red!   01/15/2009 01:29 AM     
  @Red!  
 
i believe it is in relation to the two competing south american unions, merocur and unasur. Mercosur is largely supported by israel, being thier only international free trade agreed nation which the like of venezuela and bolivia support unasur in the socialist model.
 
  by: bobloblaw   01/15/2009 02:51 AM     
  I have just been to a meeting...  
 
about this situation in Gaza and my friend is so happy to hear this news.
about this situation in Gaza and my friend is so happy to hear this news. He never knew about such an informative site being Irish, lol.

He will be joining this site as soon as possible, he can not believe this site, and I think we will have a few new members after tonight.
Sorry for my absence, but with you in my heart. :0)

So happy I have you all here, and so is he.
Great news, La Paz, a decent person at last stands for what is right.

Brown sod off, if you were slightly human you would have something to say by now.

Will leave updates on UK's here... http://www.palestinecampaign.org/...
He will be joining this site as soon as possible, he can not believe this site, I think we will ahve a few new members after tonight.
Sorry for my

 
  by: captainJane     01/15/2009 03:51 AM     
  Sorry I messed up..  
 
can an admin get my words right please, been at a meeting all night.
 
  by: captainJane     01/15/2009 03:52 AM     
  @Havoc  
 
Pick another president than Bush who was very unpopular later on, say Nixon, Coolige, Carter, whoever. The point I am making is that just because someone is voted in by a democratic process doesn't mean that they'll retain that popularity forever.

"hamas would be overthrown for the inside if they weren't still supported"
How do you know that they still are? Do you really believe this latest incursion is boding well for them? Do you think they're all cheering and happy in Gaza for their Hamas because the Israelis are back?

What is it about that clip you have such a problem with? If I found another outlet that translated that video that wasn't known for bias, would you believe it then?

"where'd i say i believe that..."
Why were you so quick to write off that video if you didn't agree with it?

"if they weren't fighting for the greater good (atleast of their people and what was/is their land) then you wouldn't be fighting at all."

If they weren't fighting, then you wouldn't be fighting at all. Yes. True. What's your point?

"then maybe they should look at their history and their own recent actions, they definately do deserve it, but the innocent people that tend to get caught in the middle never do"

Hamas hides weapons caches amongst the population as well as their offices. Aaccording to international law, this would make them responsible for the deaths.

It seems like you and many others are of the mind that yes, *some* action is warranted because of the rocket attacks from Gaza into Israel, but what you don't seem to understand is what it takes to remove this threat. They are so dug in there that to make any sort of lasting difference from their action means bombing sites where Hamas has hidden weapons among innocent people. How evil do you have to be to put your own people in danger like that? Is Hamas really that stupid to believe that the Palestinians who unknowingly live next to key weapons storage sites are not at risk of being killed by the IDF?

"except Israel is the aggressor of the scenerio and have been for 60 bloody (quite litterally bloody) years"

So every single attack on Israel by Palestinians, be it in the form of a car bombing, a suicide bombing, katushya/qassam rockets, etc. are all justified in your eyes because they are simply responses to Israel's wrongs?

"the gaza stripe and the west bank are the concentration camps, thats the part people can't wrap their heads around"

Including me. The only similarity is that they're living in a small area not accessible by other countries. Israelis aren't trying to exterminate the Palestinian people. You make it sound like Israel strong-armed their way into the area. That's not what happened at all.

"even hitler had the decency to explicitly kill the jews rather than make them suffer their ENTIRE life, sure he made them work in camp until they were useless to him then killed them, but atleast the suffering was short lived"

How can you compare the level of suffering incurred by Jews forced into labor during WWII to the current situation in Palestine? Do you realize the kinds of things the Nazis did to the Jews in the concentration camps? How is suffering for in some cases YEARS in his camps "short lived?" I'm not disagreeing with you that Palestinians are living shitty lives in a shitty area, but it's nothing like the torture and abject brutality from back then.
 
  by: caution2     01/15/2009 05:14 AM     
  @caution  
 
to answer your question as to what it will take to make hamas stop rocketing israel...

israeli's would have to leave the caananite, oops, i mean "terrorist", wait, i mean, "palestinians..." who knows anymore. They would have to leave because IT'S NOT THEIRS JUST BECAUSE SOME A HOLE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY SAID IT WAS. They don't deserve it i don't care about the holocoust sh88 happens nobody from teh crusades got handed over a country.

hamas has every reason to be pissed. they are being over run in their own territory because of the big bully in teh west (us.) We call them terrorists but if someone was invading your shi4 you would bomb their a$$es too. Kinda like attacking Iraq because a bunch of Saudi's flew a plane into a couple of buildings... and they only did that because we gave them guns in the 80's and let them beat the russians and now ... oh God i could go on forever. How do we stop violence in the world, we get out f''kin noses out of their business.
 
  by: mrmarler     01/15/2009 05:29 AM     
  @caution2  
 
"How do you know that they still are? Do you really believe this latest incursion is boding well for them? Do you think they're all cheering and happy in Gaza for their Hamas because the Israelis are back?"

their support of hamas is not limited to their effort against the israel occupation and constant incursions, but shifty farker already covered that.

and yes it is boding well for them, not for the palestinians but definately for hamas, their support has grown , not diminished, did you read the link in the previous post?

"What is it about that clip you have such a problem with? If I found another outlet that translated that video that wasn't known for bias, would you believe it then?"

my problem is with the source of the video and the known bias of the organization producing it... much like how the US media deliberately or inncorrectly changed the meaning of bin laden videos before thay started releasing fake videos altogether.

"Hamas hides weapons caches amongst the population as well as their offices. Aaccording to international law, this would make them responsible for the deaths"

and... doesn't the US israel and most other nations have military operations (bases) within cities... i know they do... because we have them here in canada like that too.

again another massive double standards, esspecially since they are being occupied and have the inhereit right as such to resist.

i don't know that palestinian even have military bases much less close enough to be effective with such crappy weaponry... care you give them something with a bit more range or a proper military base... although that would just make it really easy for israel to completely crush any resistance due to superior weaponry. are not military and government offices TYPICALLY located withing cities... hell the pentagon is located in a city, one of, if not the most fortified military installations in the world; and its located in a city...

and please keep in mind this place; the gaza strip and the west bank are virtually prisons of israel, its one of the most densely populated and most highly restrictive areas in the world.

"So every single attack on Israel by Palestinians, be it in the form of a car bombing, a suicide bombing, katushya/qassam rockets, etc. are all justified in your eyes because they are simply responses to Israel's wrongs?"

the attack are, yes... not nessessary the targets, civillians should never be target EVEN if you are resisting occupation... however they aren't aiming in the same way israel does, theay dont have guided weaponry, only crude rockets and bombs, and a butt-load of ak-47/74's...

and suicide bombing is extreme yes, but less face it, its the only way they can actually aim their weapons, plus they can be quite powerful compared to some rockets.

"Including me. The only similarity is that they're living in a small area not accessible by other countries. Israelis aren't trying to exterminate the Palestinian people. You make it sound like Israel strong-armed their way into the area. That's not what happened at all."

extreminate, starve and/or refuse aid from other countries from reaching them (this has probably killed more palestinians than israel's actual attack have), or force them to leave (hitler's holocaust did the same it forced many to either leave the country or go into hiding like anne frank did)., not a whole lot different just an a MUCH, MUCH larger scale or a much long timeframe...

if you were going to imprison 1.3-1.4 million people in concentration camps wouldn't it be more economical and flat out easier to do it the way israel has?... think about it

and yes they did strong arm into the area, the UN strong armed them into another populations land, and they [israel] strong armed the palestinians into increasingly smaller areas of land... that is what happened
 
  by: HAVOC666     01/15/2009 06:05 AM     
  @caution2  
 
"How can you compare the level of suffering incurred by Jews forced into labor during WWII to the current situation in Palestine? Do you realize the kinds of things the Nazis did to the Jews in the concentration camps? How is suffering for in some cases YEARS in his camps "short lived?" I'm not disagreeing with you that Palestinians are living shitty lives in a shitty area, but it's nothing like the torture and abject brutality from back then."

lol... then many you should read more news about isreal and the palestinians, a few yews of suffering CANNOT EVER compared to a lifetime of it even it is was more harsh, most palestinians have NEVER known the level of freedom or security that even most middle eastern have, every jew atleast had time to get alittle dose of freedom and security before hitler snuffed it out..

i find it simply astounding that anyone who would've been against hitler's holocaust wiping out and oppressing an entire group of people could in any way support israel over the palestinians...

would you have been faulting the jews if they rose up against hitler firing rockets and denoting bombs all over germany to kill the people that are oppressing and killing them... if not i don't see how or why you would fault the palestinians... its ludacris that such double standards exist, much less are prodominate.
 
  by: HAVOC666     01/15/2009 06:17 AM     
 
 
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