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08/15/2009 06:54 AM ID: 80206 Permalink   

Senator Predicts Universal Health Care

 

Sen Dennis Kucinich (D-OH) doubts the proposed health care reform will succeed. Kucinich has gone on the record stating he wants a public plan being the only option for healthcare reform.

Kucinich has stated that the problem with the private system is bureaucracy imposed by insurance companies. "One of every three dollars goes to the activities of the for-profit system," Kucinich said. He is a co-sponsor of House Resolution 676.

Resolution 676 is a bill that would make the senior medicare system to Americans of all ages. Only 85 members of the House have signed the bill.

Kucinich also thinks there will be no reform bill passed this year.

 
  Source: www.wcpn.org  
    WebReporter: willyshawker Show Calling Card      
  Recommendation:  
ASSESS this news: BLOCK this news. Reason:
   
  23 Comments
  
  this is why  
 
I think alot of people don't want this government option. They are afraid it will turn into universal and not to many want that except the far far far left.

It's scary the government totally in control of healthcare IMO.

We need some type of written guarentee it will not lead to this and something that can't be overturned except by American vote
 
  by: willyshawker     08/15/2009 07:06 AM     
  That's his opinion  
 
... and he's entitled to it. But I don't think we're going to have a single-payer system any time soon, and I do think we'll have a health care reform bill this year. I'd like to see a public option in it, but I'll take a major reform of the rules the industry has to play by.

I look at it as a pretty simple issue. We need to have affordable, quality health care available to all Americans. If you're against that because it comes from the government OR because it comes from the private sector, you're nothing more than a hard-headed partisan ideologue.

What we can't do is let the system stay broken because some Republicans see this as Obama's "Waterloo" or because some Tea Party Patriots feel that *any* health care reform bill will be a defeat for them. We can't let an issue that affects every American get hijacked by the fringe.

But what I'd like to know is why, after seeing Obama get the stimulus bill passed, Sotomayor confirmed to the Supreme Court, etc., anybody thinks that a good portion of what the president is calling for isn't going to pass. Members of Congress know that a couple hundred people who come out to their town hall meetings are not representative of the public at large -- they do polling all the time. And I don't think they're too endeared by having swastikas painted on their offices, being hung in effigy or having tombstones with their names on them displayed in the protests. That's anger to the point of insanity -- that's not mainstream America.
 
  by: Ben_Reilly     08/15/2009 07:12 AM     
  @willy  
 
OK. Once again.

In the United Kingdom, the government controls the National Health System, meaning the majority of doctors and hospitals work for/are run by the government.

They still, however, have private hospitals. They still have about 12 percent of the populace carrying private health insurance.

Nobody's going to make you do anything! Do you honestly think that the Democratic Party's membership feels they can remain in power if they start forcing people to do things they don't want to do?

Use your common sense, for God's sake!
 
  by: Ben_Reilly     08/15/2009 07:14 AM     
  @Ben/ do you have link about french system  
 
what if it is Mainstream America and your in the opinion that is in the minority. Then what are your thoughts?

The polls are showing reform but not this reform and I have agreed with you on reform being needed. This is a touchy issue with you as is most I can see the anger coming from ya which there is nothing wrong with. This is America after all.

At least it seems you do not agree w/a Universal Plan which makes me feel very good. We both agree that the ourburst are wrong as well that has been discussed with us.

Well to me if Obama had the power in the Senate to pass this it would have been done already. I think he is falling out of favor with the Democrats so nothing is guarenteed anymore. The politicans are going into protect mode right know as they always do w/election year coming up so I really don't see it being passed this year. They are not sure of the outcome of the Americans opinions.

Polls dont nearly cover all of the American opinion but I believe every poll out there has Obama and the COngress approval rating dropping.

It will be interesting to see what it is later this week becuase last time he spoke at a townhall it dropped a point or 2 I believe.

I don't think we see anything to at least 2012 if then and then the follwoing things must happen.

In 2010 and 2012 Democrats stay in control then it will be passed in 2012.

If in 2010 and 2012 Democrats lose seats or become the minority no reform will happen which will suck.

We can't let the system stay broke thats for sure. What Obama and the democrats need to do is go on Fox News at night between 7 and 11pm and give there ideas to the American public.

As much as some of you hate Fox news you have to admit they beat the ratings for every network and cable news shows between 7 and 11 and by very convincing margins. Go where the majority of folk are getting there news tell your side there who knows you might convert a few people like I said after watching him I felt a little better about the government option. Go where the people watch and throw down.

PS. Hannity is an idiot I used to like him but he has gotten way to extreme
 
  by: willyshawker     08/15/2009 07:25 AM     
  but...  
 
In this guys words he doesnt want ANY private healthcare which is just wrong and will never pass.

I just think this is the reason alot of people are very weary of this. Does it make it right? NO
 
  by: willyshawker     08/15/2009 07:27 AM     
  willy  
 
What's so scary about the government being in control?

And before you answer, remember I'm really asking: what is scar-IER- about the government being in control than for profit business being in control.

I know which of the two I trust more, and it's not for profit business.

Also to echo Ben - universal healthcare doesn't mean private healthcare is going to be illegal, just that everyone without it will still get good care. Also it means that the private companies will be competing with the government, which means prices will be lower and care provided will be better. Competition is always good.
 
  by: jamesmc   08/15/2009 08:11 AM     
  @jame  
 
becuase our country was founded on the principles of very little federal government power. It's not the way America was intended to be doing so spits on the grave of every American who has died for this great country.

Also on the echo to Ben I realise that but that isnt what this guy wants he want no, zero, zilch, none for private healthcare.

I trust neither equally ask them to take a paycut to pay for healthcare and see how much they really care. Oh you bring up a good point. Competing w/the government. Well how do you compete w/the government? Answer that honestly!

There are 2 main issues here.

1. Finding a way to pay for it and I have proposed ways our government won't want to do and they are stop sending money over seas, collect money that is owed to us pretty much Help America First, we can also slash all public officials pay by 50 percent excpet the President, and cut out needless spending, none of which the government wants to do. SO ask yourself again do they really care? Be Honest now!.

2. IF the private system where to compete w/government and beat it out and the government option started to bleed. What happens then? Does it go out of business? Do we borrow money to keep it going? Raise Taxes? See a very good question. After all Obama said it would be self sustaining right?
 
  by: willyshawker     08/15/2009 09:17 AM     
  also @ jame  
 
interesting you bring up you fear the private over the government a majority of Americans think the oposite

Data released earlier today shows that 51% of voters fear the federal government more than private insurance companies when it comes to health care decisions. Forty-one percent (41%) have the opposite fear.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/...
 
  by: willyshawker     08/15/2009 09:23 AM     
  @willy  
 
Why would you not reduce Presidential salary in concert with those of other public servants?

BB
 
  by: bbeljefe     08/15/2009 03:54 PM     
  @willy  
 
I think you need to study up on the various health care systems. For one thing, you keep talking about "universal" health care as though that's something horrible, when all that means is that everyone has health care. Right now 85 percent of Americans have some kind of coverage (nearly 30 percent of them from the government). Universal coverage simply means 100 percent of the population is covered, either because the private sector has made insurance affordable and offered it to everyone regardless of their health, or because there's a government system helping those without private insurance, or because there's a government system competing with private insurance, etc.

Second of all, HOW DARE you presume to tell me what my ancestors who fought and died to protect America were dying for? Why don't you piss on their graves while you're at it? You act as though every American who's ever died for his or her country was a Republican or a libertarian. That's shameful.

And what does "zero, zilch, none for private care" even mean? Do you honestly think that anyone intends to *illegalize* private insurance when no other country in the world, including those that have the most socialized health systems, has done so?

Private insurance can compete against public insurance just like FedEx competes against the Post Office, Evian competes against tap water, private schools compete against public schools and automobile manufacturers compete against public transportation. It's a very common phenomenon in America.

As far as the polls go and my predictions, time will tell, of course. I suspect a lot of Democrats would like to go on Fox News, but they have to be invited first. Fox News isn't too welcome to opposing ideas -- you may have noticed they always pretty much agree with one another. It's not by accident; google "fox news" "talking points" and you'll see what I mean.

And finally, some links about French health care:

A great Dallas Morning News article that covers almost the entire picture: http://www.dallasnews.com/...


The World Health Organization's ranking of nations on quality of health care: http://www.photius.com/...
 
  by: Ben_Reilly     08/15/2009 04:35 PM     
  that's the keey thing  
 
"We need to have affordable, quality health care available to all Americans." that's the key thing... available not forced down our trouats. not all people want health care. some can npt afford it and others should not be forced to pay for someone elses health care. remove all illegals, stop all th efree intitlements to them and stop all foriegn aid. use the money that is being spent on these items to fund care for those that can not afford it.
 
  by: shannon853   08/15/2009 04:43 PM     
  @Ben. @bb  
 
I'll check out the links study them and get back to you.

You said Second of all, HOW DARE you presume to tell me what my ancestors who fought and died to protect America were dying for? Why don't you piss on their graves while you're at it? You act as though every American who's ever died for his or her country was a Republican or a libertarian. That's shameful.

You know thats not what I'm getting at, it has nothing to do w/political parties it has to do w/what our forefathers created thats what they fight for to protect that. They wanted very little government control and to go against that is spitting on there graves.

It's like if your mom dies and she request something like she wants to be buried in this dress but you dont like it and bury her in another dress.

Another thing I would like an answer, You bring up a interesting point with Fed-Ex and UPS competeing with the government a very intereting one. Fed-Ex and UPS have pretty much run the Post Office out of business, it is a financial mess, it loses money and is cutting workers but guess what even though its bleeding its still here. Kinda a waste of money don't you think even though the post office is a constitutional thing. It's time to cut ties w/that and put mail into the private sector because once again a government program is failing. Does that mean cHealthcare will fail? NO, but the government doesnt have a very good track record.

Also then same as above. It goes w/paying for healthcare this is a perfect example how if a self sustaining program (healthcare) loses money we wont cut the program but we will borrow money to keep it going which in return at some point raises taxes. Interesting isn't it.

It goes back to my 2 points

1. Finding a way to pay for it and I have proposed ways our government won't want to do and they are stop sending money over seas, collect money that is owed to us pretty much Help America First, we can also slash all public officials pay by 50 percent excpet the President, and cut out needless spending, none of which the government wants to do. SO ask yourself again do they really care? Be Honest now!.

2. IF the private system where to compete w/government and beat it out and the government option started to bleed. What happens then? Does it go out of business? Do we borrow money to keep it going? Raise Taxes? See a very good question. After all Obama said it would be self sustaining right?

@bb. I say keep the President pay becuase he actually has to work day in and day out for sometimes even a whole day
 
  by: willyshawker     08/15/2009 05:33 PM     
  another  
 
reason I personally don't think it gets passed is because polls are showing that the American public now trust the republicans more than the democrats on most issues http://www.rasmussenreports.com/...


Also that 54 percent of the public thinks passing no plan right now is better than the current plan proposed
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/...

Looks like mainstream America is against this and not for it.
 
  by: willyshawker     08/15/2009 05:37 PM     
  @willy  
 
Rasmussen has a well-known conservative bias; they're practically the Fox News of pollsters. Find me a non-Rasmussen poll that says *anything* like that and I'll start to take notice.
 
  by: Ben_Reilly     08/15/2009 05:52 PM     
  @Ben  
 
I actually didn't know they where right leaning. Don't really know of any more sites that have as much detail info as them. Yesterday was my first day going there.

ANy response to my rebutal about the Post Office system failing vs Fed Ex and UPS
 
  by: willyshawker     08/15/2009 06:13 PM     
  @willy  
 
The Post Office works just fine for me. I mailed DoubleTake a book recently, he got it just fine and it cost me less than $2 in postage. I use Blockbuster Online and get a lot of packages delivered from Amazon, and they all get to me just fine through the USPS. I think they do a fine job and I really couldn't ask for anything more.

That said, they are having financial problems, just like EVERYBODY ELSE during this horrible recession that started under the Bush administration.

In fact, I'm really tired of hearing about how it's "the government" that can't do anything right when Bush and the rest of his morons were in charge for eight years. Let's let competent people run the government before we rush to judgment, OK?
 
  by: Ben_Reilly     08/15/2009 06:45 PM     
  @Ben  
 
I have gone on the record and stated Does past programs mean the government won't be able to run healthcare? NO, but they don't have a good track record.

That was the peoples fault 8 yrs of Cheney and his cronies (Bush)but its not just his administration a matter of fact has nothing to do with the President its the government in general.

No denying the Post Office does a good job they do but even before the DEPRESSION (recession is just a made up word IMHO) they where losing money has nothing to do w/the economy.

Once again you have not answered the question. What happens if the government option goes broke because the private industry offers something better? WHat do we do in your opinion. Shut it down? Raise Taxes? Borrow Money?

I noticed people for this plan keep ignoring that question. Is there a reason why? Do you not know the answer? I know our government doesnt know the answer.

My question now is how do you support something you don't know all the answers to? How can a government who supposedly is looking out for us pass a bill that they dont know the answers to? It's very dangerous going into something you don't know the answers to isn't it? This isn't figure it out as we go along type stuff. This is real life important questions. It isn't some game. Your dealing w/peoples lives. You don't go in to something like this w/o a plan or w/o all the answers.

 
  by: willyshawker     08/15/2009 06:55 PM     
  also @ Ben  
 
I forgot you said competent people run it now. What competent people? I sure don't see any. I hope you don't mean Pelosi (the liar just like Cheney). We read stories everyday how incompetent our government is on the federal and local level but you want me to give them the benfit of the doubt? That ship has sailed along time ago.

If you want me to believe you can be competent. If you want me to believe you can run something successfully. PROVE IT. We in America have giving our politicans plenty of benefit of the doubt and time and time again they fail.

You want it. PROVE IT. Plain and Simple. No more free passes. Prove IT. Show us change not more of the same. PROVE IT. Earn the benefit of the doubt back until then. They are pure incompetence
 
  by: willyshawker     08/15/2009 07:00 PM     
  @willyshawker  
 
Well, I didn't mean to prove it, but check out my recent article about the stolen Mexican oil. : )

Like I say, I don't demand a public option, though I think it would be the most cost-effective way to insure those who don't have private plans. I'll be quite happy, as well, to see insurance companies no longer be able to deny people policies because of pre-existing conditions, and no longer be able to practice rescission.
 
  by: Ben_Reilly     08/15/2009 10:06 PM     
  @ Ben  
 
hey we can agree on something else.

I'll be quite happy, as well, to see insurance companies no longer be able to deny people policies because of pre-existing conditions, and no longer be able to practice rescission. I agree
 
  by: willyshawker     08/15/2009 10:14 PM     
  @ben  
 
Your bias is glaringly obvious.

Both political parties are deep-seeded with corruption. Bush's actions as president certainly didn't help our economy, but placing the entire fault upon his administration is naive at best.

Government intrusion into healthcare markets created the corrupt system we face today. Nixon's HMO act was seemingly beneficial at first glance, but it's real purpose was to incease profits for privledged companies while reducing overall quality of care. You can read the dialogue between Nixon and his corporate conspirators here:

http://en.wikisource.org/...


Bottom line: Once Government is allowed to meddle in what would otherwise be a free market, it opens the door for corporations to infiltrate the very regulatory agencies that are intended to keep playing fields equal.

When the US's healthcare markets were freest, we had care second to none in terms of both cost and services provided. After some of FDR's and Nixon's laws, the system transformed into a profit devouring machine intended to supply little care at extreme expense.

If a mechanic broke my car while driving it, I certinaly wouldn't trust him to fix it. The same goes for Government and healthcare.
 
  by: austrian   08/16/2009 02:11 AM     
  I believe that the people of the  
 
United States should have the exact same health care system as members of Congress. Why should they have something better than the rest of us?
 
  by: walter3ca   08/16/2009 11:30 AM     
  The unanswered question  
 
"what happens if the government option goes broke because the private industry offers something better?"

This is the whole point of having a government option, at least in the eyes of corporatist Dems - If the private sector produces something ACTUALLY WORTHWHILE and COST EFFECTIVE that doesn't make people go broke, lose their homes and die, and covers everything no matter what, then the public option has done its job, and forced private industry to bend to the needs of the people.

This won't happen at all unless there is a strong public option to compete against the industry.

You can't expect the industry to compete against itself. Left to their own devices, these companies just make deals with each other to raise costs, deny coverage and inflate profit. It would be incredibly naive to suggest that they would do otherwise if they are not forced to.

So there's your answer. If the private companies produce a better product, then that's the result of the proposed competition! If they don't, then guess what? The people still have a good public product available to them.

So the people win no matter what, and the industry only wins by complying with our needs and making an honest effort to provide a worthwhile product to the people.
 
  by: MattL   08/18/2009 03:06 PM     
 
 
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