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09/08/2010 06:28 PM ID: 85380 Permalink   

Man Arrested for Defending Family With Gun Against 20 Gang Members


George Grier had to use his AK-47 assault rifle to defend his home against more then 20 rampaging gang members.

Grier fired four warning shots after gang members said they were going to kill him, his wife, and his children. The gang members are believed to be members of MS-13, a notorious criminal organization.

When police arrived, they arrested Grier saying it was reckless endangerment to fire the warning shots. Grier was then investigated for firearm possession. The gun was completely legal and registered to him. Grier also had no criminal record.

    WebReporter: Tetsuru Uzuki Show Calling Card      
ASSESS this news: BLOCK this news. Reason:
  Amerika... We have a system designed to  
punish the victims and reward the criminals.
  by: slavefortheman     09/08/2010 06:46 PM     
Just wow.
  by: deadvenusblue     09/08/2010 06:52 PM     
  Kudos to this guy  
That´s the way to protect yourself and your family.

And f*ck the cops, bunch of testosterone junkies trying to arrest any1 for any reason to get a $$$ bonus.
  by: jhax   09/08/2010 07:05 PM     
  Two words  
Jury Nullification
  by: bala_mt   09/08/2010 07:06 PM     
  devils advocate  
I´m just going to play devils advocate. You people complaining, it wasn´t your family that was robbed right? What if you and your son were outside playing and the falling bullets struck and killed one of you? You´d have a son without a father or a father without his son.

Falling debris kills hundreds of people every year from idiots who fire their guns in the air.

I applaud the man for defending his family. I applaud him for having everything legal. However he should know better than to fire his weapon into the air.

You´re not allowed to do that at the range. He should know better. The only time you pull out a weapon is to USE it. Not to scare people with it. All he needs is a reasonable amount of suspicion that his life is in immediate danger (or his family) and he could have laid waste to all of them.
  by: vex   09/08/2010 07:25 PM     
He fired the warning shots into the ground, which is what military and police are trained to do. Its obvious this man had firearm training. He did not discharge the rounds into the air.
  by: Tetsuru Uzuki     09/08/2010 07:30 PM     
I am unfamiliar with Ney York laws but some states require you to try and flee before resorting to leathal force (not that I agree with this idea at all). That said the whole "lay waste to them all" idea is probably a bit touchy in one of the most anti-gun states in the US.
  by: bala_mt   09/08/2010 07:41 PM     
  I´m on the cops side on this one  
BUT! only because he was arrested. I feel the arrest(coupled with reasonable bail) is justified. If he gets convicted then I´ll be pissed. Oh, and, Good job Grier. F-ing punks! Next time no warning shots!

[ edited by VermiciousG ]
  by: VermiciousG     09/08/2010 09:06 PM     
  And people ask why you need an assault weapon...  
Because a group of gang members outside your house CAN happen.

AK-47, the very best there is. When you absolutely, positively, have to kill every single mother#@!&%# in the room; accept no substitute.
  by: d-man   09/08/2010 09:10 PM     
You should take a look into what MS-13 is .. it is a very serious Mexican killing gang, and coming face to face with them in that large of a group, you wouldn´t even stop and start debating with yourself about maybe I shouldn´t do blah blah blah .. look into who MS-13 is, then put yourself into that guys shoes .. get the facts on MS-13

  by: Key2000     09/08/2010 09:28 PM     
  Pretty considerate  
I don´t know what started the altercation, but this was an appropriate way of staying in control of the situation.
I doubt he get prosecuted for it.
  by: MannyisHere     09/08/2010 09:47 PM     
  Legal defense fund?  
Anyone finds a legal defense fund for the guy please post it here.
  by: VermiciousG     09/08/2010 10:28 PM     
And he survived? Of course the cops came for HIM. They don´t have the balls to go after MS-13.
  by: walter3ca   09/08/2010 11:21 PM     
No, they didn´t arrest him. They´re just asking him for advice.
  by: VermiciousG     09/08/2010 11:58 PM     
  I´m with you d-man....  
Any gang that comes to my front yard and threatens my family is going to take casualties, lots of them. And if I knew ahead of time it was MS-13 or some other organized gang it would be all out war. I would not mess around with warning shots. No one would leave the yard walking. I have had way too much of this insanity. This guy has my full and complete support. The cops are cowards for not arresting the gang members. I got fed up with the gangs when I was living in the city. Now we have the Native Mob here and the killing is running amuck on the Rez. In one year we had a 1% death rate in town due to gang murders. A mile from my house gang members dismembered a rival gang member, gouged out eyes, cut off body parts and eventually killed the guy. Enough already!

I blame most of this on our politicians and their war on drugs. Drugs are what fuels the fire, supplies the money for the guns and the desire for drug territory. It is no different than Capone and Chicago during prohibition. Take away the drugs sales and the money gained from it and what guy will want to hang around with a bunch of broke dick poor mother fu@king guys. How fast did the Chicago gangs vaporize when alcohol was legalized? The same will happen here. Legalize and bankrupt the gangs. Prohibition has never worked, doesn´t work now and will never work. All it does if fuel an underground black market and the lawlessness that goes with it.

"We the People" end up the victims of the gangs and our own police. Our civil rights go down the toilet and no one is safe.
  by: valkyrie123     09/09/2010 12:00 AM     
"He fired the warning shots into the ground, which is what military and police are trained to do."

I don´t know about the police, but the military are trained to never fire warning shots.
  by: lafinjack   09/09/2010 12:55 AM     
You assume that the men outside his home were gang members, and you assume they were armed, though the source article doesn´t tell us whether or not this is true.

You probably assume that this is the case going on this guys reaction, grabbing an assault weapon and shooting it.

Suppose that there were five men outside this guy´s home for a period of time (this is all that we know to be true) - and this man was freaked out unnecessarily for one reason or another. Perhaps he is mentally unwell, perhaps he is a gang member himself (might explain why he has a freaking ASSAULT WEAPON in his HOUSE) who has a hit out on him because of something he has done to a rival gang (might explain a possible paranoid reaction to members of the public happening to be outside his house).

In my opinion if he has an AK47 in his HOUSE then there is probably a reason for it, he´s either paranoid, or expecting trouble.

Anyway so he goes way over the top, gets his AK and runs outside shouting, surprise surprise, more people show up to see whats going on. This is where the "13 people" in the source comes from. So he gets more intimidated or paranoid and he shoots the gun, risking people´s lives (yes he shot into the ground but there may have been an accident, or he may have prompted other people to start shooting.

Well fortunately other people didn´t start shooting, and the police only had to arrest one loony. This could easily have been a situation where the police would have had to carry away multiple body bags because some member of the public either got spooked or they correctly identified this loon as a threat and shot him back. As I said, fortunately that wasn´t the case but if it had been, it wouldn´t have been if the guy didn´t have a freaking ASSAULT WEAPON in his HOUSE!!

[ edited by jamesmc ]
  by: jamesmc   09/09/2010 01:28 AM     
I think this Dilbert cartoon fully addresses your thoughts on why the guy had an AK-47
  by: jhax   09/09/2010 03:29 AM     
good point lol

  by: MannyisHere     09/09/2010 04:27 AM     
  if it were me  
I´d be in jail for shooting all of them. If a gang of 20 threatened to kill my family there would be no warning shots...just a bunch of knee shots. And if I had it, there´d be Molotov cocktails flying as well.
  by: shaohu     09/09/2010 04:58 AM     
Quote:In my opinion if he has an AK47 in his HOUSE then there is probably a reason for it,

Well the story does say the gang threatened to kill his wife and kids. So a good assumption would be he lives in a bad neighborhood and the reason for the AKA is for PROTECTION. I would rather have the largest semi auto I could afford for protection rather then a BB gun wouldn´t you? What part of threatening his family didn´t you get?

[ edited by hellblazer ]
  by: hellblazer     09/09/2010 04:58 AM     
the story sounds funny.
Out of no where they just happen to want to kill his family?

Once this guy fired, he would of been shot by someone then his family shot too. One gun against 20 people isn?t going to do anything.
This guy is lucky and smart to alert the authorities and get official help.

[ edited by MannyisHere ]
  by: MannyisHere     09/09/2010 05:08 AM     
ha ha ha...that´s funny. Call authorities and wait for help? That won´t help the situation in the long run. The gang knows the guy has a big gun and that he knows how to use it, this will be much more of a deterrent for future gang attacks rather than hiding behind the police´s useless apron. I prefer to take the Dirty Harry approach rather than dealing with all the legal BS. But maybe that´s just me.

[Harry Callahan has to explain why he shot a man]
Harry Callahan: Well, when an adult male is chasing a female with intent to commit rape, I shoot the bastard. That´s my policy.
The Mayor: Intent? How did you establish that?
Harry Callahan: When a naked man is chasing a woman through an alley with a butcher´s knife and a hard-on, I figure he isn´t out collecting for the Red Cross!
  by: shaohu     09/09/2010 06:39 AM     
"Well the story does say the gang threatened to kill his wife and kids."

That´s all the reason I´d need. They can scream legalities and jail sentences to me later as much as they´d like. People are gonna drop if they try that $#!t with my daughter on the line. Even though I have a mere 12 gauge.

[ edited by VermiciousG ]
  by: VermiciousG     09/09/2010 08:13 AM     
  No need?  
If there´s no need for assault rifles like the AK, how is it even legal to obtain one and legally own it?

I can say one thing though, purchasing an AK47 to defend your family is a helluvalot cheaper than moving away from the scum that caused you to buy it in the first place.
  by: Rokkumon   09/09/2010 08:36 AM     
  you can own AK´s  
but it can not be a fully automatic for it to be legal. It is fairly easy to file down a certain piece in the gun to make it fully auto though. Same goes for any gun, including pistols. My friend turned his handgun into a fully automatic one that would empty an entire clip in a matter of seconds.

and I´m still in favor of "Better to have a gun and not need it rather than to need it and not have it"
  by: shaohu     09/09/2010 09:38 AM     
Sure, you can legally own full auto´s, I have two of them.

I have a MAC-11 and an HK MP5 A4. There is a huge misconception that full auto´s are not legal. If you can own a handgun, chances are you can own a full auto.

It´s called an NFA registered weapon, the tax stamps run you $200 dollars and full auto guns can be anywhere from 4,000 to 25,000 easy and even more if you want something other then a MAC-10~11 or an M16 etc.

It´s not that the guns cost that much, it´s that the only legal full auto´s were made and registered between 1934 and 1986. In 1986 they suspended the registration of newly made transferable machine guns into the hands of private parties. However they grandfathered the ones already registered which means they can be owned as well and bought and sold legally.

Due to the fact there are no MORE full autos that can ever be made for private parties though, they skyrocketed in price and keep going.

Full auto guns are a major investment for those of us who "collect" them.

That said, the FA guns stay locked in a safe but I do keep an LWRC M6A2 (M4 style rifle) in the bedroom for protection. I also keep a Wilson Combat CQB with a tactical light close by and I always carry a 1911 we well as a KAHR P9.

I wouldn´t say I expect trouble but I´m ready if it comes. Be it one person or 20...

I do have quite a bit of firearms training too btw. ;)
  by: kristmen   09/09/2010 10:23 AM     
the gun is cheaper than moving away... not safer.
  by: midgica   09/09/2010 10:37 AM     
cool, I didn´t know that.
I´ve got just a normal gun license and normal guns (no automatics).

Ever been to a gun show in TX? Pretty cool (and sometimes scary). I understand now why people say "Don´t mess with TX"
  by: shaohu     09/09/2010 11:16 AM     
"If there´s no need for assault rifles like the AK, how is it even legal to obtain one and legally own it?"

There is no need for pecan pies. That doesn´t mean that it´s illegal to have one. Anything that isn´t strictly forbidden by the constitution or U.S. law is legal.
  by: VermiciousG     09/09/2010 03:10 PM     
Not in combat. MPs and such for crowd dispersal were trained to fire warning shots into the ground. This may have changed somewhat in the last decade with the widespread used of less then lethal weapons, tear gas etc. The idea is if rounds are going off at their feet, they back up. I´m 100% positive places like China and North Korea still use this tactic. Its visible in the footage from 1989 Tiananmen Square protest before they start mowing down people.
  by: Tetsuru Uzuki     09/09/2010 05:25 PM     
Dude you got it all wrong...

Its a velocoraptor with a jet pack and scissors...

Pop off a some warning shots with one of THOSE!!!
  by: richie65x   09/09/2010 05:25 PM     
You really have no idea what gang violence is like, do you? If he tried to call the police, him and his family would´ve been dead before they got there. Try moving to a place where this kind of crap happens and you´ll understand why people react the way they do. Not everyone can live in a safe area -- if they could, there would be no such things as dangerous places to live in the first place, because noone would live there! There will always be dangerous places to live, and not everyone can just run away from it.
  by: velger   09/09/2010 08:16 PM     
Really? I´ve never seen a woman walk over to a new neighbor with an AK47 to welcome them to their community. Now, I have seen many pies handed out. A pie can comfort an enemy into becoming a friend. An AK47 will only comfort the person dishing the bullets out. I try to think of peaceful resolutions for both sides.

Was I surprised by your joke of a response? No. Especially considering the overwhelming irrationality of many of the comments all across the ShortNews site. Nice to see people take serious, every day topics as a large joke. You can dish out your laughable comments, but when you´re the one in the ShortNews article and get clowned, just expect the same sort of treatment you give the people in every single article you comment to.
  by: Rokkumon   09/09/2010 09:00 PM     
Ok, well, thanks for the ever so eloquent chiding but I think if you read into my comment a little deeper you´d find that I was agreeing with you.

Maybe I could´ve put more thought into what I typed but then maybe you could´ve put more thought int what you read.
  by: VermiciousG     09/09/2010 09:45 PM     
  Oh, and  
I think that Mr. Grier probably did find the only peaceful resolution possible with a gang like ms-13.
  by: VermiciousG     09/09/2010 09:48 PM     
  This is a shame  
Guns were initially created to fight wars with. Great Britain versus the U.S. The right to bear arms was created for our safety incase the British invaded our lands. We could try to defend ourselves against Britain´s armies. Now it seems the greatest threat to our country is not another country. It´s ourselves. The day that it is necessary to even own an AK-47 at home for protection just goes to show this country of ours is no longer for the brave and the free. It´s for whoever has the most money, power, and strongest security. This isn´t freedom. This is a mess that is playing Russian roulette with turning into chaos. I fear for this country.
  by: Student_of_the_World     09/09/2010 09:55 PM     
Check your history. The right to bear arms was added was added to protect the people from an overzealous government not from foreign fighters.
Also an AK-47 is no more dangerous than any other firearm it just happens to look a bit more aggressive. Why everyone seems to have a problem with this particular firearm is beyond me. Luckily for us you have the freedom to not own any guns and I have the freedom to own whatever firearm I can legally buy. You also have the freedom to wait for the cops to come save you in their 5 - ? min response time. While I have the freedom to defend myself with any of my firearms when necessary or at least hold back an attacker long enough for the cops to arrive.
Man it is great to live in a free country. It’s just too bad so many people in this free country are insistent on giving up freedoms for security.
Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety deserve neither Liberty nor Safety – Benjamin Franklin
  by: bala_mt   09/09/2010 11:00 PM     
My point is the fact we need to own a weapon at all is terrible. I know this is the world we live in now. The way to solve this problem is to love one another. I know that sounds cheesy but I don´t care. It´s amazing we´d rather turned to guns and violence, but when someone mention words like "love" and "be nice" people scoff at you like you´re the idiot. I think people should calm down and learn to live and let live. Unfortunately, the world the way it should be will never exist on this Earth. People hold on to grudges too much. Too many people interested in guns and shooting people before they try talking out the situation. I just wish there wasn´t a need for weapons.
  by: Student_of_the_World     09/09/2010 11:22 PM     
  It should be noted that....  
The police are in no uncertain terms ´Required´ to protect you:

The man featured in this story had the charges levied against him because of how prosecutors offices get their funding... By the number of, and severity of the crimes they successfully prosecute. (non-federal) Law enforcement agencies throughout the land all share a common agenda in regards to this goal.

Actions like these are so common that many of my friends who are in law enforcement (4 Sheriff and 2 FBI) look at it as kind of a game of "Lets see what else we can get ´em on" and frequently laugh at the end results.
  by: richie65x   09/09/2010 11:25 PM     
Bake a pie? For MS-13 members?

I´m sorry, but have you considered psychiatric help?
  by: velger   09/09/2010 11:47 PM     
Wouldn´t we all like a perfect world.
  by: bala_mt   09/09/2010 11:49 PM     
For MS-13? Probably a flan would be best. Maybe some sopapillas.
  by: VermiciousG     09/09/2010 11:58 PM     
flan: the happy dessert!

sign me up :)
  by: midgica   09/10/2010 01:29 AM     
I totally agree with you too. The war on drugs is a big part of the violence problem. Legalization would lower organized crime and gang activity significantly. In general though it seems that our society is currently violence prone. We have to deal with that fact and protect ourselves.
  by: d-man   09/10/2010 10:00 AM     

Yea that´s great go ahead and just blame the victim... You´re right, of course the man who defended himself must have been crazy and there must have been no gang members. What normal person would defend himself? No no no that´s not the way we do things these days in America. Normal people hide in their homes and hope the cops aren´t minutes away when seconds count. You´re totally right, the victim should go to prison.

If the gang members weren´t real why didn´t they call the police after they ran off to report some crazy man shooting at them? If I were randomly shot at I would report it when I was safe. If they had come forward he would be facing additional charges. The police have not indicated that they don´t believe his story of gang activity. They just didn´t like him discharging his fire arm. This is generally the case in most urban areas. Even here in Houston, TX you will get charged if you discharge your firearm in self defense within the city. In case of self defense i think it´s bullshit to get charged, but chances are any decent judge will throw it out.

Ok so where should he keep his AK? Owning an assault weapon is not being paranoid or expecting trouble... All weapons are just tools. Think of it like insurance. You never expect to be in a car wreck, but you still have car and health insurance if you are. Right? Well you never expect to have 20 gang members outside your house either. Considering an AK-47 or AR-15 are cheaper than a half a year of car insurance why not have the added protection? Also they are fun guns to shoot.

"yes he shot into the ground but there may have been an accident, or he may have prompted other people to start shooting"

So it´s OK for the other people to have guns but not this victim? Now you´re contradicting yourself. If you believe only crazies and criminals have guns then he obviously either had a bunch of crazies in front of his house or a bunch of gang members (also probably crazies.)

"Well fortunately other people didn´t start shooting, and the police only had to arrest one loony."

It´s so great to see the police arrest victims isn´t it?

[ edited by d-man ]
  by: d-man   09/10/2010 10:23 AM     
I´m not the idiot trying to justify the lethality of an AK47 to the humble pecan pie. The last time someone unloaded an AK47 on a crowd, many people were killed. The last time someone unloaded an AK47 on a crowd, the only thing that was lost was the fat woman´s dignity when she grabbed another piece.

This is exactly the BS I talked about in my last post. Most of the logic on here astounds me. You think I´m the one that needs help, yet any time you can find a way to justify the means of killing what you should just call an infidel, you´re going to do it. It´s just sick. I liken most of the people on here to an American Jihad. They find the most bull ways to justify killing, as do you. Yet when something happens, you get all up in arms about it. If the country were run by more people like the people on shortnews, we´d´ve been molested by bombs ages ago.
  by: Rokkumon   09/10/2010 08:29 PM     
One gun, I don´t care how automatic, would do anything if 2 or more of those guys have guns themselves. I´m sorry. If three people have guns and you only have a certain amount of bullets with no back-up or help, your going down. Just because its an AK-47 doesn´t mean your Rambo, there is a possibility you could get hit without even getting one shot out.

If this guy shot one person, and more than one person had a weapon he would of been shot himself. Or the gang would come back later.
If he were to kill someone, without being in fear of his life, he would of went to jail. Then the gang would probably actually murder his family.

[ edited by MannyisHere ]
  by: MannyisHere     09/10/2010 08:51 PM     
  edit** x.x  
The last time someone unloaded a pecan pie on a crowd, the only thing that was lost was the fat woman´s dignity when she grabbed another piece.
(could swear I saw an edit button somewhere)
  by: Rokkumon   09/10/2010 09:39 PM     
  Val If I knew Ahead Of Time  
I would have my family and myself in a safe place.

I have nothing worth a human life, especially my family´s.
  by: ichi     09/10/2010 10:59 PM     
First to the person who says “the only time you pull a gun is to use it” That is a misconception of the uninformed
If you are able to defend your life without firing shots into another human being then you do so.

This young man did everything right; everything. He is the model for responsible gun ownership. I say that as a NRA instructor and a person who has had a CCW licenses for over 25 yrs. Had he fired into the air or at a cement sidewalk he would be wrong.

He fired into the grass where there was no chance of ricochet. 20 people about to bum rush your house constitutes a threat to your safety. Moreover anyone in that situation would have a reasonable concern for their safety. This is crystal clear to anyone with a healthy mind. I feel as if he was one of my students, because he handled the situation so well.

Now this is where I turn some people off. The reason he was arrested is because he is a black man with a LEAGLE weapon.
And he is in the north east. North east police do not like armed civilians in general and do not like legally armed black civilians in particular. Just my view based on personal experience from when I lived in CT. I further contend that if he were white, the only thing he would have to worry about fending off right about now would be movie deals.

I would say it was less than 6 mo ago when a white man shot and killed 2 black robbers with a illegal shot gun and NO charges where filed. (may have movie deal coming) this was in NYC proper. It is clear to me that most of the post here are for the young man and people have taken a position based on principle and not race. However I contend that the police did not.

[ edited by UncleRuckus ]
  by: UncleRuckus   09/13/2010 05:11 PM     
  I like  
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[ edited by TonyViet ]
  by: TonyViet   02/01/2013 05:17 AM     
  I like  
I like the valuable info you provide in your articles. I’ll bookmark your weblog and check again here regularly. I’m quite sure I’ll learn many new stuff right here! Good luck for the next!

  by: TonyViet   02/01/2013 05:18 AM     
  I´m just going  

I´m just going to play devils advocate. You people complaining, it wasn´t your family that was robbed right? What if you and your son were outside playing and the falling bullets struck and killed one of you? You´d have a son without a father or a father without his son.Falling
debris kills hundreds of people every year from idiots who fire their guns in the air.
  by: TonyViet   02/01/2013 10:22 AM     
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